Cross-examination of Denise Lewis (2 of 2)

📄 Cross-examination of Denise Lewis (2 of 2) — Tuesday, June 27, 1995

Address:

C:\DEPT103\CRIMINAL\1995\JUN\27\CROSS-EXAMINATION-OF-DENISE-LE.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 104 of 167

◀ Cross-examination of Denise Lewis Witness dismissal ▶

Witness: Denise Lewis
Examiner: Robert Blasier
Called by: Prosecution • Date: Tuesday, June 27, 1995 • Utterances: 122

Defense attorney Robert Blasier cross-examines LAPD criminalist Denise Lewis about her handling of evidence received from the Coroner's office, focused on clothing and trace evidence belonging to Ron Goldman and Nicole Brown Simpson. Lewis repeatedly admits she never isolated commingled trace evidence (hair, debris) into separate bindles for Coroner's evidence, couldn't verify how items had been preserved before reaching her, and that identifying marks on evidence bags — including other examiners' initials — were added only after she processed the items.

# 1 (Brief pause.)

# 2 MR. BLASIER:

When you have items--debris or hair or trace evidence come off of an item onto the paper, do you make any effort to preserve that particular trace evidence in a separate bindle so that you can reconstruct at some later time when trace evidence came off of an item?

# 3 MS. LEWIS:

What do you mean by "When" exactly?

# 4 MR. BLASIER:

Well, you indicated at least with one of the items that some trace evidence came off and you saw it on the paper, you took the paper and you poured it back in the bag?

# 5 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 6 MR. BLASIER:

Now, would you agree that there is no way, if someone looked at this later and other trace evidence came off the item, you would have no way of telling the sequence in which things might have come off an item because they weren't preserved in separate bindles?

# 7 MS. LEWIS:

Exactly.

# 8 MR. BLASIER:

You had never done that where--when something comes off of it, you put it in a separate bindle so you know when it came off, who was there, what the circumstances were?

# 9 MS. LEWIS:

Not with Coroner's evidence, no.

# 10 MR. BLASIER:

With regular--with other evidence you do that?

# 11 MS. LEWIS:

Some evidence that is gathered in the field, if something falls off, then it is going to get packaged in a coin envelope at that time and it is indicated in my notes where the item was removed from.

# 12 MR. BLASIER:

Okay. But you don't do that with Coroner's evidence?

# 13 MS. LEWIS:

No.

# 14 MR. BLASIER:

And is that because of--you have no way of vouching for how the evidence is actually collected and preserved by the Coroner's office or it doesn't matter?

# 15 MS. LEWIS:

I have no way of knowing how it came from the Coroner's office, correct.

KEY QUOTE

# 16 MR. BLASIER:

So it is not going to make any difference to you to preserve it separately because you can't tell how it was preserved originally?

# 17 MS. LEWIS:

Exactly.

# 18 MR. BLASIER:

The hair that you found in the shoe bag, that was in a separate bindle, was it not?

# 19 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 20 MR. BLASIER:

Is there any indication on that bindle as to which shoe it came from?

# 21 MS. LEWIS:

It didn't state it came from a shoe.

# 22 MR. BLASIER:

Where did it state it came from?

# 23 MS. LEWIS:

It didn't state. It was just in a brown paper bag that was in the--in the other bag.

# 24 MR. BLASIER:

Was there any identifying information at all as to where it came from?

# 25 MS. LEWIS:

No.

# 26 MR. BLASIER:

Did you find that unusual?

# 27 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 28 MR. BLASIER:

Were there any markings on it at all?

# 29 MS. LEWIS:

The bag had "Hair" written on it, but I don't recall if I put "Hair" on it or if it came from the Coroner's office that way.

KEY QUOTE

# 30 MR. BLASIER:

You would never preserve something that way and just write "Hair" on it and nothing else?

# 31 MS. CLARK:

Objection, irrelevant.

# 32 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 33 MR. BLASIER:

Now, the one bag had both the pants and the socks in it, correct?

# 34 MS. LEWIS:

Correct.

# 35 MR. BLASIER:

Was there any indication on the socks as to which one was on the left foot and which one was on the right foot?

# 36 MS. LEWIS:

No.

# 37 MR. BLASIER:

Is that something that you would ordinarily record as standard procedure so that you could correlate the socks perhaps to the shoes?

# 38 MS. LEWIS:

I haven't.

# 39 MR. BLASIER:

Did you consider putting the socks, one in each separate bag?

# 40 MS. LEWIS:

No.

# 41 MR. BLASIER:

That is because they were already mixed up with the pants, right?

# 42 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 43 MR. BLASIER:

Now, the pants also in the bag that you got, the bag just said "Pants and socks," didn't it?

# 44 MS. LEWIS:

From the Coroner's office I would have to verify.

# 45 MR. BLASIER:

Okay. Let me show you People's 423. Does that appear to be the bag, the pants and the socks?

# 46 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 47 MR. BLASIER:

And could we zoom in on the writing, please.

# 48 MR. BLASIER:

Now, the pant and the socks, you have no idea who wrote that, do you?

# 49 MS. LEWIS:

No, I don't.

# 50 MR. BLASIER:

No initials at all about who wrote that?

# 51 MS. LEWIS:

No.

# 52 MR. BLASIER:

Then you have a "Plus" and a "Debris" that appears to be a different kind of ink. Do you have any idea who wrote "Plus debris"?

# 53 MS. LEWIS:

That is my scribble.

# 54 MR. BLASIER:

Okay. When did you put that on there?

# 55 MS. LEWIS:

When I was doing the evidence.

# 56 MR. BLASIER:

So that wasn't on there when the Coroner's office sent it to you?

# 57 MS. LEWIS:

No, it was not.

# 58 MR. BLASIER:

And there is something underneath where you say "Debris" that is scribbled out. Do you have any idea what that is?

# 59 MS. LEWIS:

I have a guess of what it was.

# 60 MR. BLASIER:

What is your best estimate?

# 61 MS. LEWIS:

I believe I was trying to put down about the bindle again.

# 62 MR. BLASIER:

Okay. So that certainly wasn't on there when you got it from the Coroner's office?

# 63 MS. LEWIS:

No, it was not.

# 64 MR. BLASIER:

Now, could we come in a little bit on the lower right.

# 65 MR. BLASIER:

S.A.B. Is Susan Brockbank, correct?

# 66 MS. LEWIS:

Yes, she does.

# 67 MR. BLASIER:

She works at SID?

# 68 MS. LEWIS:

Yes, she does.

# 69 MR. BLASIER:

Not at the Coroner's office?

# 70 MS. LEWIS:

Correct.

# 71 MR. BLASIER:

So would you presume that was put on sometime after you processed it?

# 72 MS. LEWIS:

Yes, it was.

# 73 MR. BLASIER:

"C.Y." Is Collin Yamauchi?

# 74 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 75 MR. BLASIER:

That would have been put on after you processed it?

# 76 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 77 MR. BLASIER:

So is it accurate to say that the only thing on that bag when it came from the Coroner's office was "Pants, socks."

KEY QUOTE

# 78 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 79 MR. BLASIER:

And showing you People's 425, the pants, when they came out of the bag, again were all rolled up, weren't they?

# 80 MS. LEWIS:

I don't know if they were rolled or folded.

# 81 MR. BLASIER:

There was no paper used to try and keep one area of the pants from touching other areas of the pants and contaminating them?

# 82 MS. LEWIS:

Exactly.

# 83 MR. BLASIER:

And you didn't make any effort to do that because what is the use, right?

# 84 MS. LEWIS:

It is already been contaminated or handled, I should say, not contaminated.

KEY QUOTE

# 85 MR. BLASIER:

It is already been mixed up so what might now be on the bottom of the pant might now be on the top and vice versa?

# 86 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 87 MR. BLASIER:

Let me show you People's 427. Now, you indicated when you looked at the socks there was no debris on the paper after you--after you set them out, correct?

# 88 MS. LEWIS:

Correct.

# 89 MR. BLASIER:

Now, you would agree that in this picture there is debris there?

# 90 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 91 MR. BLASIER:

Now, this picture was taken at some other time, I assume?

# 92 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 93 MR. BLASIER:

When was this picture taken?

# 94 MS. LEWIS:

No knowledge. I could determine it if I looked at the tag, but that is only from what is stated there. I was not present at the time. It appears to be 7/27/94.

# 95 MR. BLASIER:

So that is sometime after--clearly after you looked at them, a month after you looked at them?

# 96 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 97 MR. BLASIER:

It is not unusual, is it, for evidence like clothing to have trace evidence fall off of it one time and not another time?

# 98 MS. LEWIS:

No, it is not unusual.

KEY QUOTE

# 99 MR. BLASIER:

Do you have any idea whether the debris from the sock in that picture was ever preserved in a separate bindle?

# 100 MS. LEWIS:

No knowledge.

# 101 MR. BLASIER:

Now, the dress and the panties were also kept in the same bag, correct?

# 102 MS. LEWIS:

They were received from the Coroner's office in the same bag, yes.

# 103 MR. BLASIER:

All kind of mixed up together?

# 104 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 105 MR. BLASIER:

And you put them in separate bags, correct?

# 106 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 107 MR. BLASIER:

Was there any indication on the bag with the--with both the dress and the panties as to what case it was connected with?

# 108 MS. LEWIS:

No.

# 109 MR. BLASIER:

You indicated this morning that there was a slight delay in Mr. Goldman's items being booked?

# 110 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 111 MR. BLASIER:

What did you mean by that?

# 112 MS. LEWIS:

The items were received from, according to my record, from Miss Degrandis on June 27th, 1994, and they were physically booked into--the report was made and the items were physically booked into the evidence processing unit, or I'm sorry, evidence control unit, on June 28th.

# 113 MR. BLASIER:

That is the delay you were referring to?

# 114 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 115 MR. BLASIER:

And being booked into the evidence processing unit, that is where they bar code it and it is put into the security system there at the property unit at the lab?

# 116 MS. LEWIS:

Yes.

# 117 MR. BLASIER:

Now, the tag on the box that you were asked to identify that you said was not your writing, do you know whose writing it was?

# 118 MS. LEWIS:

No.

# 119 MR. BLASIER:

May I have a minute, your Honor?

# 120 THE COURT:

Certainly.

# 121 (Discussion held off the record between Defense counsel.)

# 122 MR. BLASIER:

That's all I have, your Honor.

Temperature

tense

Key Quotes (5)

Denise Lewis

I have no way of knowing how it came from the Coroner's office, correct.

Core admission that LAPD criminalists could not verify or vouch for how Coroner's office evidence was collected or preserved before reaching the lab.

Denise Lewis

It is already been contaminated or handled, I should say, not contaminated.

A near-slip in which Lewis starts to say 'contaminated' before self-correcting to 'handled' — exactly the word the defense wanted associated with the evidence on the record.

Robert Blasier

So is it accurate to say that the only thing on that bag when it came from the Coroner's office was "Pants, socks."

Establishes that Susan Brockbank's and Collin Yamauchi's initials, plus Lewis's own 'Plus debris' notation, were all added to the evidence bag after the fact — feeding the defense's evidence-mishandling narrative around Yamauchi.

Denise Lewis

The bag had "Hair" written on it, but I don't recall if I put "Hair" on it or if it came from the Coroner's office that way.

Shows the hair found in the shoe bag had no notation of which shoe it came from or any other identifying information, and Lewis herself found this unusual.

Denise Lewis

No, it is not unusual.

Lewis concedes it's not unusual for trace evidence to appear in a later photo (taken a month after her exam) that wasn't present during her original examination, raising questions about evidence integrity over time.

Evidence (5)

People's 423

Evidence bag containing Ron Goldman's pants and socks as received from the Coroner's office, later marked with additional writing and examiner initials.

displayed and examined for handwriting/markings

People's 425

Ron Goldman's pants, shown rolled/folded as removed from the evidence bag.

displayed

People's 427

Photograph of the socks showing visible debris, dated approximately 7/27/94 — about a month after Lewis's original examination.

displayed and challenged

Informal

Hair found in a shoe bag among the Coroner's office evidence, with no notation of which shoe or other identifying information.

discussed and challenged

Informal

Nicole Brown Simpson's dress and panties, received from the Coroner's office commingled in a single bag with no case-identifying markings.

discussed and challenged

Notable Exchanges (2)

Robert Blasier•Denise Lewis

Blasier methodically establishes that Lewis never separated commingled trace evidence (hair, debris) into individual bindles for Coroner's office items, meaning no one could later reconstruct when or how trace evidence transferred between items.

strategic

Robert Blasier•Denise Lewis

Line-by-line examination of the writing on People's 423 reveals the original Coroner's bag said only 'Pants, socks,' with Lewis's 'Plus debris' scribble and Susan Brockbank's/Collin Yamauchi's initials all added afterward.

revealing

Credibility Attacks (1)

⚔ Denise Lewis

procedural impeachment

Blasier extracts a series of admissions that Lewis's evidence-handling for Coroner's office items (no separate bindles for trace evidence, no left/right sock identification, no case markings on victim clothing bags) fell short of standard field-evidence practice, undermining confidence in the chain of custody for key clothing items.

Witness Demeanor

(Brief pause.)

(Discussion held off the record between Defense counsel.)

Objections

1 objections (1 sustained, 0 overruled)

Proceeding 7930 • 122 utterances • Prosecution witness

Criminal Trial

Department 103