Sidebar: blood evidence testing

📄 Sidebar: blood evidence testing — Friday, September 29, 1995

Address:

C:\DEPT103\CRIMINAL\1995\SEP\29\SIDEBAR-BLOOD-EVIDENCE-TESTING.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 164 of 167

◀ Closing argument — Marcia Clark (part 2) Closing argument — Marcia Clark (part 3) ▶

Date: Friday, September 29, 1995 • Utterances: 27

A bench sidebar erupts over the accuracy of Dr. Henry Lee's trial testimony about blood evidence testing near the air conditioner at the Rockingham property near Kato Kaelin's house. Marcia Clark argues the record supports her closing argument characterization; Barry Scheck insists he corrected the record at the time by cutting off testimony about presumptive testing. Judge Ito reads the transcript aloud, finds the dispute unresolved, and tables it until the full record can be pulled.

# 1 (The following proceedings were held at the bench:)

# 2 THE COURT:

We got a problem here. Never mind. Go ahead. By the way, counsel, one of you gets to make objections; not both of you. I have warned you about that three times now.

# 3 MR. COCHRAN:

All right.

# 4 THE COURT:

It is not trial by committee.

KEY QUOTE

# 5 MR. COCHRAN:

Forgive us. Sometimes it is something that we want to get to you right away and we are both speaking, so that is why that happened, your Honor.

# 6 (Brief pause.)

# 7 THE COURT:

This appears to be, if you read the entire thing, quote, he said he found nothing out there.

# 8 MS. CLARK:

No, that is not--

# 9 MR. SCHECK:

Not only that, let's make it very clear, and I'm sure the court recalls this, and that is that I came in the next day and made a specific objection on the record because this was a situation where he was about to bring up presumptive testing. And then I said, "You have answered the question" and cut it off and I made a specific objection on the record because Dr. Lee would have come back and testified that what he did was a swipe on the air conditioner and he got a positive, but a positive that came not from what in his opinion was blood, but from the fact that you tests the surfaces, you are going to get positives, and I made that specific objection on the record.

# 10 THE COURT:

Hold on, hold on.

# 11 MR. SCHECK:

Ruling about closing argument--

# 12 MS. CLARK:

You know--

# 13 THE COURT:

Hold on.

# 14 MR. SCHECK:

Mr. Goldberg knows--

# 15 THE COURT:

Hold on. It does not appear--that argument does not appear to be supported by the record.

# 16 MS. CLARK:

Your Honor, you know something? You are only looking at one page. I will get the other pages for you. It is exactly what the witness said. Have I misrepresented what the witness said?

KEY QUOTE

# 17 THE COURT:

Hold on. Hold on. It is five minutes to noon. Move on to something else. Skip this point and we will pull the record. This is from volume 213.

# 18 MS. CLARK:

I read the record. That is all I did.

# 19 THE COURT:

Counsel. "Question: Now, in addition to that, doctor, when you were at the Rockingham location did you have occasion to find any item that in your forensic opinion was consistent or appeared to be blood in the area of the air conditioning near Kato Kaelin's house? "Answer: Yes, sir. "Question: And was that something that you believed that--that you thought appeared to be blood? "Answer: I test some door knobs, some sink traps and air conditioner. "Question: I am just asking about the air conditioner." "I saw"--the answer is: "I saw in different places."

# 20 MS. CLARK:

Including the air conditioner, your Honor.

# 21 MR. COCHRAN:

No.

# 22 MS. CLARK:

That is what he said. What are we talking about here? Those are his words.

# 23 MR. SCHECK:

I came in and corrected her on the record.

# 24 MS. CLARK:

They can deny reality. They are in denial about this. That is what he said.

KEY QUOTE

# 25 THE COURT:

Keep your voice down. Wait a minute. There is only one person, Mr. Cochran, who is arguing.

# 26 MR. COCHRAN:

All right.

# 27 THE COURT:

It is noontime. Let me pull the full record. Move on to something else.

Temperature

tense

Key Quotes (4)

Lance A. Ito

It is not trial by committee.

Ito rebukes the defense for double-teaming objections, a recurring issue he says he has warned about three times.

Barry Scheck

I came in the next day and made a specific objection on the record because this was a situation where he was about to bring up presumptive testing... he got a positive, but a positive that came not from what in his opinion was blood, but from the fact that you test the surfaces, you are going to get positives.

Scheck's core argument: Dr. Lee's air conditioner test was a false positive from surface contamination, not actual blood, and he claims he shut down the testimony before that distinction was made clear.

Marcia Clark

They can deny reality. They are in denial about this. That is what he said.

Clark's frustration boils over — she accuses the defense of misrepresenting what is clearly in the transcript.

Marcia Clark

You know something? You are only looking at one page. I will get the other pages for you. It is exactly what the witness said. Have I misrepresented what the witness said?

Clark pushes back directly at the judge, suggesting his reading is incomplete.

Evidence (1)

Informal

Trial transcript volume 213 — Dr. Henry Lee's testimony about testing door knobs, sink traps, and the air conditioner at Rockingham near Kato Kaelin's house for blood

read aloud by judge, disputed by both sides

Notable Exchanges (2)

Marcia Clark•Barry Scheck•Lance A. Ito

All three speak over each other as Clark and Scheck argue competing interpretations of Dr. Lee's air conditioner testimony; Ito repeatedly says 'Hold on' before reading the record himself and finding the dispute unresolved.

heated

Lance A. Ito•Johnnie Cochran

Ito reprimands the defense for both Cochran and Scheck making objections simultaneously, calling it 'trial by committee' and noting it is the third such warning.

firm/procedural

Objections

None recorded

Proceeding 7884 • 27 utterances

Criminal Trial

Department 103