Richard Rubin, the glove expert, is recalled and shown a new pair of Aris leather light gloves (People's 401) that he had not previously seen. He confirms they are the same make, model, style, and color as the Rockingham and Bundy gloves. He also describes measuring OJ Simpson's hands during the morning break, and Darden asks him to demonstrate the measurement technique on a court officer — prompting Cochran to request a sidebar.
# 1 MR. DARDEN: Your Honor, the People call Mr. Rubin back to the stand.
# 2 THE COURT: All right. And I released Mr. Rubin again last time, so we need to reswear him.
Richard Rubin, (Recalled) recalled as a witness by the People, having been previously sworn, resumed the stand and testified further as follows:
# 3 THE CLERK: Please raise your right hand. You do solemnly swear that the testimony you may give in the cause now pending before this Court, shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God.
# 5 THE CLERK: Please have a seat on the witness stand and state and spell your first and last names for the record.
# 6 MR. RUBIN: Richard Rubin, R-U-B-I-N.
# 7 THE COURT: Mr. Darden.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. DARDEN
# 8 MR. DARDEN: Good morning, Mr. Rubin.
# 9 MR. RUBIN: Good morning, Mr. Darden.
# 10 MR. DARDEN: Mr. Rubin, you returned to Los Angeles at my request?
# 11 MR. RUBIN: That's correct.
# 12 MR. DARDEN: And when did you arrive back in L.A.?
# 13 MR. RUBIN: A little after eight o'clock last night.
# 14 MR. DARDEN: Were you brought to my office?
# 15 MR. RUBIN: Yes, I was.
# 16 MR. DARDEN: Did we meet and talk?
# 17 MR. RUBIN: Yes, we did.
# 18 MR. DARDEN: Did I she you some objects or items in my office last night?
# 19 MR. RUBIN: Yes, you did.
# 20 MR. DARDEN: What did I show you?
# 21 MR. RUBIN: You showed me four different pair of Aris lights gloves.
# 22 MR. DARDEN: And what were the sizes of those gloves?
# 23 MR. RUBIN: I believe one was a small, one was a large and two were extra large.
# 24 MR. DARDEN: Okay. Did you see a medium?
# 25 MR. RUBIN: And also a medium.
# 26 MR. DARDEN: Okay. So you saw five pairs of gloves?
# 28 MR. DARDEN: Showing you a pair of Aris leather light gloves, may these be marked People's next in order?
# 32 (Peo's 401 for id = pair of brown leather gloves) # 33 MR. DARDEN: And I am indicating 401 on the inside of the tag, your Honor.
# 34 MR. DARDEN: Showing you what has been marked People's 401 for identification.
# 36 MR. DARDEN: You didn't see those gloves in my office last night, did you?
# 37 MR. RUBIN: No, I did not.
# 38 MR. DARDEN: When was the first time you saw those gloves?
# 39 MR. RUBIN: Three, four minutes ago.
# 40 MR. DARDEN: I'm going to ask you to take a look at those gloves, if you will.
# 41 MR. RUBIN: (Witness complies.) Yes.
# 42 MR. DARDEN: And do you have fresh in your mind the style and appearance of the Rockingham and Bundy glove?
# 43 MR. RUBIN: Yes, I do.
# 44 MR. DARDEN: Those gloves were Aris leather lights; is that correct?
# 45 MR. RUBIN: Yes, they were.
# 46 MR. DARDEN: What is the make and style of the gloves in your hand?
# 47 MR. RUBIN: This is Aris leather light style 70263, brown, extra large.
KEY QUOTE # 48 MR. DARDEN: Now, the gloves you saw from Rockingham and Bundy, were they extra large gloves?
# 49 MR. RUBIN: The left glove that I saw was definitely an extra large.
# 50 MR. DARDEN: And the other one?
# 51 MR. RUBIN: In its current condition I believe it is closer to a large than an extra large or it is a very small extra large at this point in time.
KEY QUOTE # 52 MR. DARDEN: Okay. And was there some unique kind of stitching on the Rockingham and Bundy glove?
# 53 MR. RUBIN: Yes, there was.
# 54 MR. DARDEN: What kind of stitching was that?
# 55 MR. RUBIN: It is called Brossier stitching. It is a very fine whip stitch.
# 56 MR. DARDEN: And the stitching on the gloves in your hand now marked People's 401?
# 57 MR. RUBIN: Is the same.
# 58 MR. DARDEN: Okay. Same color?
# 59 MR. RUBIN: Same color, brown, very--slight different shade, but the colors do vary between pairs.
# 60 MR. DARDEN: May I have one moment, your Honor?
# 62 (Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.) # 63 MR. DARDEN: So is it your testimony that the gloves marked 401 are the same make, model style and style as the glove from Rockingham and Bundy?
# 64 MR. RUBIN: Yes, they are.
# 65 MR. DARDEN: Now, what is the size of the gloves there in front of you?
# 66 MR. RUBIN: These are extra large.
# 67 MR. DARDEN: Okay. And this is a tag that indicates that they are extra large; is that correct?
# 68 MR. RUBIN: Yes, both inside the glove and outside the glove.
# 69 MR. DARDEN: Now, during the break this morning did you measure Mr. Simpson's hands?
# 70 MR. RUBIN: Yes, I did.
# 71 MR. DARDEN: Okay. Would you describe for the jury how you conducted that measurement?
# 72 MR. RUBIN: Basically I took my right hand and put it up against Mr. Simpson's left hand. I took a pen from my pocket and I put the pen in the crotch of Mr. Simpson's finger and I slid my hand up against his hand to give me a finger length measurement. After that I then took a normal soft tape measure, put it in the palm of Mr. Simpson's hand, moved the ruler over to the ten-inch mark, wrapped the actual soft tape measure around the hand, thus giving me the approximate circumference of his left hand and his right hand, which is the conventional way that we would measure someone's gloves for size.
# 74 (Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.) # 75 MR. DARDEN: Your Honor, could I have Mr. Rubin step down and show the jury how he conducted these measurements, using Mr. Bell?
# 76 THE COURT: Certainly.
# 77 MR. DARDEN: Mr. Bell.
# 78 MR. COCHRAN: Your Honor, may we--
# 79 (Discussion held off the record between Defense counsel.) # 80 MR. COCHRAN: May we approach just for a moment, your Honor?
# 81 THE COURT: All right. With the reporter.