Direct examination of Jack McKay

📄 Direct examination of Jack McKay — Tuesday, July 11, 1995

Address:

C:\DEPT103\CRIMINAL\1995\JUL\11\DIRECT-EXAMINATION-OF-JACK-MCK.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 112 of 167

◀ Redirect examination of Shirley Baker Cross-examination of Jack McKay ▶

Witness: Jack McKay
Examiner: Johnnie Cochran
Called by: Defense • Date: Tuesday, July 11, 1995 • Utterances: 132

Jack McKay, CFO of the American Psychological Association, testified about playing golf with OJ Simpson at a corporate tournament in Sterling, Virginia on June 8, 1994 — four days before the murders. The defense used his testimony to establish Simpson's friendly demeanor and a noticeable knee limp. A photograph of the foursome at the first tee was introduced as Defendant's Exhibit 1229.

# 1 THE COURT:

Good morning, sir. Would you face the court reporter. I'm sorry, the clerk.

Jack McKay, called as a witness by the Defendant, was sworn and testified as follows:

# 2 THE CLERK:

Please raise your right hand. You do solemnly swear that the testimony you may give in the cause now pending before this Court, shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God.

# 3 MR. MCKAY:

I do.

# 4 THE CLERK:

Please have a seat on the witness stand and state and spell your first and last names for the record.

# 5 MR. MCKAY:

Jack McKay, J-A-C-K M-C K-A-Y.

# 6 THE CLERK:

Thank you.

# 7 THE COURT:

Look, Mr. McKay, would you just set that cup off to the side there, please. Thank you. Mr. Cochran.

# 8 MR. COCHRAN:

Thank you very kindly, your Honor.

DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. COCHRAN

# 9 MR. COCHRAN:

Good morning, Mr. McKay.

# 10 MR. MCKAY:

Good morning.

# 11 MR. COCHRAN:

Mr. McKay, how are you employed sir?

# 12 MR. MCKAY:

I'm the Chief Financial Officer for the American Psychological Association.

# 13 MR. COCHRAN:

Did you occupation that position back in the month of June of 1994?

# 14 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, I did.

# 15 MR. COCHRAN:

And on that date did you have occasion to see Mr. O.J. Simpson?

# 16 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, sir, I did.

# 17 MR. COCHRAN:

That is Mr. Simpson seated to my left here, to my far left?

# 18 MR. MCKAY:

It is.

# 19 MR. COCHRAN:

And where did you have occasion to see Mr. Simpson on June 8th, 1994?

# 20 MR. MCKAY:

We were participating in a corporate golf tournament in Sterling, Virginia.

# 21 MR. COCHRAN:

Back in Virginia?

# 22 MR. MCKAY:

Yes.

# 23 MR. COCHRAN:

And do you remember the name of the course?

# 24 MR. MCKAY:

It was Landsdown Conference Center.

# 25 MR. COCHRAN:

And when you say "We were participating," was the organization of which you are the chief financial officer a participant in this particular tournament?

# 26 MR. MCKAY:

Yes.

# 27 MR. COCHRAN:

And you were playing there that day?

# 28 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, I was.

# 29 MR. COCHRAN:

That was a Wednesday, was it not?

# 30 MR. MCKAY:

I believe so.

# 31 MR. COCHRAN:

Would you tell the ladies and gentlemen of the jury what time on that date, June 8th, did you see Mr. Simpson?

# 32 MR. MCKAY:

One of my calling cards is being late, so I was naturally late for this golf tournament. Umm, I got there a little before 12:15, I believe, for a 12:30 starting time, and got up to the first tee and Mr. Simpson and two other players were there and we had a picture taking exercise and then we went off at 12:30.

KEY QUOTE

# 33 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. So you had what--they had a 12:30 tee time?

# 34 MR. MCKAY:

Yes.

# 35 MR. COCHRAN:

And had you ever played golf before with Mr. Simpson?

# 36 MR. MCKAY:

No.

# 37 MR. COCHRAN:

And you had occasion then to tee off with him at or about 12:30. And for how long after that did you play golf with Mr. Simpson?

# 38 MR. MCKAY:

Because we were the last foursome that went off, Mr. Simpson played, I believe, four or five holes with us, in our foursome. Then he left in his own cart and played a hole or two with other foursomes and then came back and played a few more holes with us on the back nine. So I guess collectively I was with him maybe an hour and a half, an hour and 45 minutes.

# 39 MR. COCHRAN:

And during the course of this tournament, who was one of the sponsors of this tournament, if you know, that provided Mr. Simpson?

# 40 MR. MCKAY:

You mean the corporation that sponsored the tournament?

# 41 MR. COCHRAN:

Yes, the corporation?

# 42 MR. MCKAY:

It was Hertz Rent-a-Car.

# 43 MR. COCHRAN:

So you mentioned that Mr. Simpson went off in his own cart. Did he have some kind of a golf cart he was using that day?

# 44 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, he did.

# 45 MR. COCHRAN:

During the time that you played with Mr. Simpson did you have occasion to have a conversation with him at all?

# 46 MR. MCKAY:

Yes.

# 47 MR. COCHRAN:

Answer that yes or no. At any time during the conversation did you ever have occasion to discuss with him the physical condition of his knees?

# 48 MR. MCKAY:

On one occasion he had a slight limp and I just--

KEY QUOTE

# 49 MS. CLARK:

Objection, hearsay.

# 50 THE COURT:

Overruled. He can testify to his observations.

# 51 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. Thank you, your Honor.

# 52 MR. COCHRAN:

You saw Mr. Simpson have a limp, did you not?

# 53 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, when we walked toward the ball.

# 54 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. And when you saw this, did you have an occasion to discuss with him the condition of his knees? You can answer that yes or no.

# 55 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, briefly.

# 56 MR. COCHRAN:

And did the two of you then discuss the subject matter of Mr. Simpson's knees and any problems he might be having with those knees?

# 57 MS. CLARK:

Objection, this is hearsay.

# 58 MR. COCHRAN:

The subject matter.

# 59 THE COURT:

Did you discuss that?

# 60 MR. COCHRAN:

Did you discuss that?

# 61 MR. MCKAY:

Very briefly.

# 62 THE COURT:

Thank you.

# 63 MR. COCHRAN:

Thank you.

# 64 MR. COCHRAN:

And how would you characterize Mr. Simpson's demeanor during the time that you had occasion to play golf with him these four or five holes at first and then the time afterwards?

# 65 MR. MCKAY:

He was very cordial, friendly, very willing to shake hands, sign autographs, have pictures taken. Very much different, I would say, than other celebrities that I have had an occasion to play golf with. He was a regular person that I was very comfortable with and everybody else was.

KEY QUOTE

# 66 MR. COCHRAN:

Now, you have obviously had occasion to play golf with other so-called celebrities; is that correct?

# 67 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, I have.

# 68 MR. COCHRAN:

Without mentioning any of their names, you found the demeanor and comportment--

# 69 MS. CLARK:

Objection. This is leading.

# 70 MR. COCHRAN:

Not leading. I'm going to ask question.

# 71 THE COURT:

Sounds leading.

# 72 MR. COCHRAN:

I didn't finish. Let me see if I can change it around so it won't be leading. All right.

# 73 MR. COCHRAN:

You've played with other celebrities, have you not?

# 74 MR. MCKAY:

Yes.

# 75 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. And how did Mr. Simpson's demeanor differ from those other celebrities you played with?

# 76 MS. CLARK:

Objection, irrelevant.

# 77 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 78 MR. COCHRAN:

You may answer.

# 79 THE COURT:

You may answer the question.

# 80 MR. MCKAY:

I would say that he appeared to be much more friendly than any that I have ever played with before. He was very willing to talk to you about anything. He did not put on any airs. He was just a very friendly person to be around.

# 81 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. You enjoyed your time; is that correct?

# 82 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, I did.

# 83 MR. COCHRAN:

And you mentioned the fact that you had a photograph taken with Mr. Simpson, and was there a foursome, including Simpson, when you all played?

# 84 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, there was.

# 85 MR. COCHRAN:

And did you provide me with a photograph that was taken on that date of June 8th, 1994, that includes the participants in your particular foursome?

# 86 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, I did.

# 87 MR. COCHRAN:

Is the photograph a fair and accurate portrayal--

# 88 (Discussion held off the record between Deputy District Attorney and Defense counsel.)

# 89 MR. COCHRAN:

Is that a fair and accurate portrayal of the way the four of you appeared on that date, June 8th, 1994?

# 90 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, it was.

# 91 (Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

# 92 MR. COCHRAN:

May I approach, your Honor?

# 93 THE COURT:

You may.

# 94 MR. COCHRAN:

I will mark this, your Honor, as Defendant's next exhibit.

# 95 THE COURT:

1229.

# 96 (Deft's 1229 for id = photograph)

# 97 MR. COCHRAN:

1229, your Honor?

# 98 THE COURT:

Yes.

# 99 MR. COCHRAN:

I will place the "1229" on the upper right rear.

# 100 MR. COCHRAN:

And I will place this photograph before Mr. McKay and ask Mr. McKay, is that a photograph that you brought to California and provided me with?

# 101 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, it is.

# 102 MR. COCHRAN:

And is that photograph a fair and accurate portrayal of the way the four of you looked back on June 8th, 1994?

# 103 MR. MCKAY:

Exactly.

# 104 MR. COCHRAN:

And where was that photograph taken?

# 105 MR. MCKAY:

It was taken on the no. 1 tee at Landsdown Conference Center in Virginia.

# 106 MR. COCHRAN:

The no. 1 tee is before you teed off to start playing golf; is that right?

# 107 MR. MCKAY:

That's right.

# 108 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. Let's see who is depicted--perhaps everybody can see it if I put it on the elmo, your Honor.

# 109 THE COURT:

You may.

# 110 (Brief pause.)

# 111 MR. COCHRAN:

There is a monitor right before you, sir, and I think you will be able to look at the monitor and the jury will be able to see it also in referring to it.

# 112 (Brief pause.)

# 113 MR. COCHRAN:

Now, in looking at this photograph, you have told us this is a fair and accurate portrayal of the foursome just prior to the first tee. The gentleman on the left of the photograph that is you, is it not?

# 114 MR. MCKAY:

I think so.

# 115 MR. COCHRAN:

Okay. We do recognize Mr. Simpson next to you and then who is the man to Mr. Simpson's left?

# 116 MR. MCKAY:

He is a director of some kind from the AARP organization, American Association of Retired People.

# 117 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. He was playing in this particular foursome?

# 118 MR. MCKAY:

He was one of the other organizations that was invited.

# 119 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. And the man to the representative of AARP's left?

# 120 MR. MCKAY:

He is a regional vice-president of Hertz, as far as I was told. I don't know the man, but that is how he was introduced.

# 121 MR. COCHRAN:

That is the first time you had ever played with him also; is that correct?

# 122 MR. MCKAY:

Yes.

# 123 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. So now altogether you spent about how much time with Mr. Simpson some that date, that June 8th date?

# 124 MR. MCKAY:

I would say an hour and a half to hour and 45 minutes, something like that.

# 125 MR. COCHRAN:

And during that period of time the demeanor that you have described for us, did it ever change at any time?

# 126 MR. MCKAY:

Not at all.

# 127 MR. COCHRAN:

All right. Did he sign some autographs for you also?

# 128 MR. MCKAY:

Yes, he did.

# 129 MR. COCHRAN:

And family members?

# 130 MR. MCKAY:

He signed an autograph for my daughter, a visor.

KEY QUOTE

# 131 MR. COCHRAN:

I have nothing further for Mr. McKay at this point, your Honor.

# 132 THE COURT:

All right. Miss Clark.

Temperature

procedural

Key Quotes (4)

Jack McKay

He was very cordial, friendly, very willing to shake hands, sign autographs, have pictures taken. Very much different, I would say, than other celebrities that I have had an occasion to play golf with. He was a regular person that I was very comfortable with and everybody else was.

Defense character evidence painting Simpson as affable and untroubled days before the murders.

Jack McKay

On one occasion he had a slight limp and I just--

Establishes Simpson had a visible knee problem on June 8, relevant to defense arguments about his physical limitations.

Jack McKay

One of my calling cards is being late, so I was naturally late for this golf tournament.

Self-deprecating aside that grounds the witness as credible and relatable; also establishes the precise timeline of his arrival and observations.

Jack McKay

He signed an autograph for my daughter, a visor.

Humanizing detail reinforcing Simpson's cooperative, accessible demeanor days before the crime.

Evidence (1)

Defendant's 1229

Photograph of the golf foursome — McKay, Simpson, an AARP director, and a Hertz regional VP — taken at the no. 1 tee at Landsdown Conference Center, Sterling, Virginia, on June 8, 1994

introduced and displayed on the Elmo for the jury

Notable Exchanges (2)

Johnnie Cochran•Marcia Clark•Lance A. Ito

Cochran attempts to elicit comparison of Simpson's demeanor to other celebrities; Clark objects as leading, Ito agrees ('Sounds leading'); Cochran withdraws and rephrases successfully.

procedural sparring

Marcia Clark•Lance A. Ito

Clark objects to McKay's observation of Simpson's limp as hearsay; Ito overrules, clarifying the witness can testify to his own observations.

strategic

Light Moments (1)

Jack McKay

McKay introduces himself with 'One of my calling cards is being late' before explaining his arrival time at the tournament.

Witness Demeanor

(Brief pause) — during photograph setup on the Elmo

(Discussion held off the record between Deputy District Attorney and Defense counsel)

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys)

Objections

4 objections (1 sustained, 2 overruled)

Proceeding 6720 • 132 utterances • Defense witness

Criminal Trial

Department 103