Direct examination of Dr. John Gerdes (part 4)

📄 Direct examination of Dr. John Gerdes (part 4) — Wednesday, August 2, 1995

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C:\DEPT103\CRIMINAL\1995\AUG\2\DIRECT-EXAMINATION-OF-DR-JOHN-.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 127 of 167

◀ Sidebar: defense counsel (1) Sidebar: defense counsel (2) ▶

Witness: Dr. John Gerdes
Examiner: Barry Scheck
Called by: Defense • Date: Wednesday, August 2, 1995 • Utterances: 23

Barry Scheck conducts a brief direct examination of DNA expert Dr. John Gerdes, laying foundation for his opinion on bacterial degradation of blood evidence stored in plastic bags. The exchange is mostly procedural, focused on establishing Gerdes's microbiology credentials after an initial objection on foundation grounds.

# 1 MR. SCHECK:

I'm sorry, June 13th.

# 2 DR. GERDES:

June 13th.

# 3 MR. SCHECK:

What effect would putting the wet blood swatches in the plastic bag, in your opinion, have in terms of bacterial degradation?

# 4 MR. CLARKE:

I'm sorry, objection. Objection, no foundation.

# 5 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 6 MR. SCHECK:

All right.

# 7 THE COURT:

Excuse me, counsel. The problem is the foundation as far as criminology, collection of evidence, his familiarity with the techniques, et cetera. That is the problem.

# 8 MR. SCHECK:

Dr. Gerdes, you got your Ph.D. in microbiology?

# 9 DR. GERDES:

Yes.

# 10 MR. SCHECK:

All right. Could you explain to us what a microbiologist does in terms of collecting organisms in a field setting?

# 11 DR. GERDES:

Well, a microbiologist is familiar with collection techniques for whatever specific bacterium or whatever organism they work with.

# 12 MR. SCHECK:

All right.

# 13 DR. GERDES:

So it is a fundamental part of microbiology.

# 14 MR. SCHECK:

And does your background in microbiology serve as part of your basis for your opinion about the effects that putting these blood swatches in plastic bags would have in terms of the facts of this case?

# 15 DR. GERDES:

Yes.

# 16 MR. SCHECK:

And based on your background as a microbiologist and a molecular biologist, what is your opinion about the effects of bacterial degradation of red swatches in a plastic bag for the period in question?

# 17 MR. CLARKE:

Objection, no foundation. Request the opportunity to voir dire the witness.

# 18 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 19 DR. GERDES:

The effect would be that it is going to encourage degradation and the bacteria are definitely going to grow and degrade the DNA.

KEY QUOTE

# 20 THE COURT:

I think that is perhaps the eighth time in this case we've heard that.

KEY QUOTE

# 21 MR. SCHECK:

I know, but this is the first time from a Defense witness.

KEY QUOTE

# 22 THE COURT:

Second time we have heard it from him today.

# 23 MR. SCHECK:

Let's move on to slide 1159-E--now E. No.

Temperature

procedural

Key Quotes (3)

Dr. John Gerdes

The effect would be that it is going to encourage degradation and the bacteria are definitely going to grow and degrade the DNA.

Core defense argument: improper evidence storage compromised the DNA samples.

Lance A. Ito

I think that is perhaps the eighth time in this case we've heard that.

Ito's dry aside signals the court's exhaustion with repetitive testimony on this point.

Barry Scheck

I know, but this is the first time from a Defense witness.

Scheck acknowledges the redundancy but defends the necessity of putting the argument on record through his own expert.

Evidence (1)

Informal

Blood swatches placed in plastic bags on June 13th

discussed as basis for bacterial degradation opinion

Notable Exchanges (1)

Lance A. Ito•Barry Scheck

After Gerdes repeats the bacterial degradation opinion, Ito remarks it is the eighth time the court has heard it; Scheck retorts it is the first time from a defense witness; Ito counters it is the second time from Gerdes today.

light

Light Moments (1)

Lance A. Ito

Ito counts how many times the bacterial degradation point has been made ('perhaps the eighth time'), prompting a small back-and-forth with Scheck about whose witness said it.

Objections

3 objections (1 sustained, 1 overruled)

Proceeding 7143 • 23 utterances • Defense witness

Criminal Trial

Department 103