Direct examination of Christian Reichardt by Michael Brewer

📄 Direct examination of Christian Reichardt by Michael Brewer — Monday, March 25, 1996

Address:

C:\DEPT103\DEPOSITION\1996\MAR\25\DIRECT-EXAMINATION-OF-CHRISTIA.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 22 of 31

◀ Direct examination of Christian Reichardt by Daniel Petrocelli Direct examination of Christian Reichardt by Erin Kenney ▶

Witness: Christian Reichardt
Examiner: Michael Brewer
Called by: Plaintiff • Date: Monday, March 25, 1996 • Utterances: 287

Plaintiff's attorney Michael Brewer cross-examines Christian Reichardt, a friend and personal trainer of OJ Simpson, about the June 12, 1994 phone call in which Simpson appeared to have someone with him at home. The examination then probes Simpson's emotional state (depression, agitation) in the weeks before Nicole's death, a suspicious pre-deposition visit to Simpson's house, and ends with a revelation that Simpson had told Reichardt he used cocaine during his playing days.

# 1

BY MR. BREWER:

# 2 Q:

Mr. Reichardt, I just have a few questions over the next few minutes. I want to focus your attention for a moment on the June 12th phone call.

Was it your understanding in talking with Mr. Simpson that he was packing at the time that you were having this phone call?

# 3 A:

That's right.

# 4 Q:

And when you say that he was packing, that he was physically packing as he was speaking to you on the phone?

# 5 A:

I don't know that. It might have been in the sense of I am getting my things together. Whether he is actually packing or moving around the house to get the things together, I don't know.

# 6 Q:

Well, could you hear him doing things as you were on the telephone with him that led you believe that he was putting things in suitcases or moving things around in an effort to pack at the time?

# 7 A:

No.

# 8 Q:

You indicated when you had this telephone conversation with Mr. Simpson the television was on; isn't that correct?

# 9 A:

Yes.

# 10 Q:

Based upon your ability to heard the television over the telephone could you tell what volume it was at?

# 11 A:

It was in the background.

# 12 Q:

Could you tell what room Mr. Simpson was in at the time that he was talking with you?

# 13 A:

No.

# 14 Q:

Did he tell you what room he was in?

# 15 A:

No.

# 16 Q:

Was there anything about what you heard that enabled you to discern what room he was in at the time that you had the telephone conversation with him.

# 17 A:

No.

# 18 Q:

And at some point, as you testified to, he asked somebody the score of the game; is that correct?

# 19 MR.LEONARD:

Objection.

# 20 CHRISTIAN REICHARDT:

Right.

# 21

BY MR. BREWER:

# 22 Q:

And I think the way you described it was as though he said over his shoulder, "What's the score," something of that nature?

# 23 A:

Right.

# 24 Q:

He did not yell it out, did he?

# 25 A:

# 26 Q:

So as you described it, it was a normal the pitch of his voice and the volume of his voice was normal conversation as though

# 27 A:

Well, I think it was more like he did not yell it out to somebody, but as he was speaking on the phone and you talk to somebody, and somebody catches you and you are speaking a little louder to somebody, and then he came back.

# 28 Q:

It did not appear to you as though he was yelling out the front door

# 29 A:

No.

# 30 Q:

or out the window asking somebody the score; is that correct?

# 31 A:

No.

# 32 MR. LEONARD:

Objection.

# 33

BY MR. BREWER:

# 34 Q:

Based upon the manner in which he asked that question, it was clear to you that that person was in the same room with Mr. Simpson

KEY QUOTE

# 35 MR. LEONARD:

Objection. Lack of foundation.

# 36 MR.BREWER:

Wait a second. You can make your objection but let me finish my question.

Do we have the question completed on the record?

(The record was read as follows:

# 37 Q:

Based upon the manner in which he asked that question, it was clear to you that that person was in the same room with Mr. Simpson ")

KEY QUOTE

# 38

BY MR. BREWER:

# 39 Q:

Is that true?

# 40 A:

Yes.

# 41 MR. LEONARD:

Objection.

# 42 CHRISTIAN REICHARDT:

It appeared to me like that.

# 43

BY MR. BREWER:

# 44 Q:

And your answer is yes?

# 45 A:

Yes.

# 46 Q:

And did you not hear anyone say anything in response to that question that was asked by Mr. Simpson; is that true?

# 47 A:

That's true.

# 48 Q:

Was there a period of time after he asked the question where there was some silence where you could hear them had they said something?

# 49 MR. LEONARD:

Objection.

# 50

BY MR. BREWER:

# 51 Q:

In other words Strike the question. He asked the question of somebody about the score; right?

# 52 A:

Right.

# 53 MR.LEONARD:

Objection. Lack of foundation.

# 54

BY MR. BREWER:

# 55 Q:

Was there a pause in his voice in order to allow

# 56 A:

Yes.

# 57 Q:

whoever he asked the question to to respond?

# 58 A:

Right. Yes.

# 59 Q:

Did you hear anyone say anything?

# 60 A:

No.

# 61 Q:

Were you able to still hear the television at the time?

# 62 A:

Yes. But it was making, like, background noise.

# 63 Q:

Were you able to discern that there was a game on?

# 64 A:

No.

# 65 Q:

When you say "background noise," what do you mean?

# 66 A:

You hear that there is something going on in the background televisionwise, but you cannot differentiate what it is.

# 67 Q:

Were you able to hear a voice announcing something or describing something?

# 68 A:

I didn't pay attention to that.

# 69 Q:

When you say "background noise," did you hear voices talking, gun shooting, cars crashing? What exactly .

# 70 A:

It was voices talking.

# 71 Q:

Could you tell whether it was a male voice or a female voice that you heard?

# 72 A:

I don't recall.

# 73 Q:

And was the television on, as far as you knew, the whole time that you were talking with Mr. Simpson?

# 74 A:

Yes.

# 75 Q:

And was it relatively close in the beginning of the conversation that he asked this person the score?

# 76 A:

No. It was later on.

# 77 Q:

This was about an eight-minute conversation?

# 78 A:

Yes, eight.

# 79 Q:

Was it about halfway through the conversation?

# 80 A:

Well, halfway or later. Because at first we talked about, you know, Paula and going on this trip later, towards the end of the conversation.

# 81 Q:

So there was a conversation about Paula first?

# 82 A:

Yes.

# 83 Q:

And then what was the next subject matter?

# 84 A:

That he is packing his bag.

# 85 Q:

He told you he was packing his bag?

# 86 A:

Right. But not word for word, "I am packing my bag." It was like "I'm getting my things together. I'm going to Chicago."

# 87 Q:

Did he tell you whether he had been packing earlier?

# 88 A:

No. I don't recall.

# 89 Q:

Did he say anything about that he was finishing packing?

# 90 A:

I don't recall.

# 91 Q:

He just said to you that he was packing?

# 92 A:

Yes.

# 93 Q:

And did he tell you that he was going to be back in town on Wednesday?

# 94 A:

Right.

# 95 Q:

So it was your understanding based upon what Mr. Simpson told you at that time that he was not scheduled to return from Chicago until Wednesday?

# 96 A:

That's correct.

# 97 Q:

Are you certain of that?

# 98 A:

Yes.

# 99 Q:

And did you ask him what he was going to do in Chicago for three days?

# 100 A:

No.

# 101 Q:

Did he volunteer that information?

# 102 A:

No.

# 103 Q:

Did he indicate he was going to play golf?

# 104 A:

No.

# 105 Q:

Did he indicate where he was staying?

# 106 A:

No.

# 107 Q:

So you had no idea other than the fact that he was leaving for Chicago why he was going there?

# 108 A:

Right.

# 109 Q:

Did you know whether it was a business trip or leisure trip?

# 110 A:

I assumed it was a business trip, but he didn't say anything.

# 111 Q:

Why did you assume that it was a business trip?

# 112 A:

Because he goes out of town a lot on business.

# 113 Q:

Have you ever been with Mr. Simpson when he has left on business from his house?

# 114 A:

No.

# 115 Q:

Have you ever traveled with him on vacations or otherwise leaving from his house?

# 116 A:

No.

# 117 Q:

Do you have any familiarity with his habits in terms of ordering limousine services or utilizing limousine services when he travels?

# 118 A:

No.

# 119 Q:

Was it your impression, based upon what Mr. Simpson told you, that he was leisurely packing?

# 120 A:

Yes. You know, getting this together.

# 121 Q:

But was it your sense that he was doing this in a leisurely way?

# 122 A:

Yes.

# 123 MR.LEONARD:

Objection. Asking for speculation.

# 124

BY MR. BREWER:

# 125 Q:

And did he say something to you that led you to that conclusion?

# 126 A:

No.

# 127 Q:

That was just an inference that you drew as a result of your conversation?

# 128 A:

Yes.

# 129 Q:

Did he tell you that he had to do anything else that evening to get ready to go to Chicago?

# 130 A:

No.

# 131 Q:

Did he tell you whether he was going to go have something to eat?

# 132 A:

No.

# 133 Q:

Did he tell you whether he had already eaten?

# 134 A:

No.

# 135 Q:

Did Mr. Simpson mention to you that Mr. Kaelin was at home?

# 136 A:

No.

# 137 Q:

Have you met Mr. Kaelin on previous occasions?

# 138 A:

Yes.

# 139 Q:

Have you spoken with him?

# 140 A:

Briefly.

# 141 Q:

You were familiar with his voice?

# 142 A:

That's a tough question.

# 143 Q:

As of June 12, 1994, if Kato Kaelin picked up the telephone and you had a conversation with him, would you be able to recognize that it is Kato Kaelin's voice?

# 144 A:

Yes.

# 145 Q:

If you had overheard Kato Kaelin say something to Mr. Simpson on the telephone, you would have been able to recognize that person as Kato Kaelin; is that correct?

# 146 A:

Yes.

# 147 Q:

Did Mr. Simpson say that anyone else was at home that evening?

# 148 A:

No.

# 149 Q:

Would you say that in the weeks and months before Nicole's death O.J. Simpson was depressed?

# 150 A:

No.

# 151 Q:

Not at all?

# 152 A:

No.

# 153 Q:

You never described Mr. Simpson to anyone as being depressed?

# 154 A:

I think everybody was going through so many different moods, you know, there might have been a day of being depressed, there might have been days of not being depressed, not happy, upset.

KEY QUOTE

# 155 Q:

Just so that you are clear, I really don't care about anyone else other than O.J. Simpson for the purpose of my question.

My question is: Is it fair to say that you have described on previous occasions O.J. Simpson being depressed in the weeks and months before Nicole Brown Simpson's death?

# 156 A:

I don't recall. It is possible, yes.

# 157 Q:

You are saying that it is possible that you described

# 158 A:

Yes.

# 159 Q:

And that is because he was depressed; isn't that true?

# 160 A:

At times, yes.

# 161 Q:

And at times he was upset; isn't that true?

# 162 A:

Yes.

# 163 Q:

And when you say he was upset, he was agitated in the weeks and months before her death; isn't that true?

# 164 A:

At times, yes.

# 165 Q:

Did you ever talk to O.J. Simpson about his seeking some kind of counseling or assistance in order to help deal with his agitation and depression?

# 166 A:

No.

# 167 Q:

Did he ever suggest that he was thinking about that with you?

# 168 A:

I think we talked about it at some point, that he had thought about that that might be a good idea.

# 169 Q:

To go talk to someone?

# 170 A:

Right.

# 171 Q:

And did you tell him that you thought that that might be a good idea?

# 172 A:

I think it is a good idea for anybody.

# 173 Q:

Sure. If somebody is depressed and upset over a relationship to go talk to a professional, that would be a good idea; right?

# 174 A:

Yes. Somebody who is happy who is not depressed, it is a good idea.

# 175 Q:

But you were not talking with Mr. Simpson in the context of his telling you that he was happy and thinking about seeing a counselor; right?

# 176 A:

Right.

# 177 Q:

You were talking with Mr. Simpson wherein he was describing to you being depressed and upset in the weeks and months before Nicole's death; true?

# 178 MR. LEONARD:

Objection. Misstates testimony.

# 179 CHRISTIAN REICHARDT:

Can you rephrase it or can you repeat it?

# 180 MR. BREWER:

Sure.

# 181 Q:

In the context of this discussion that you had with Mr. Simpson wherein he indicated to you that he was thinking about seeking some professional assistance, that discussion occurred while Mr. Simpson was telling you about depression and being upset with Nicole; right?

# 182 A:

But I also mentioned that it would be a good idea for me as well or anybody who is going through a difficult time. It wasn't a discussion. It was more like a comment.

# 183 Q:

A comment that you made?

# 184 A:

Yes.

# 185 Q:

You were telling Mr.Simpson that it is a good idea to get professional help for anyone?

# 186 A:

Yes.

# 187 Q:

Point being, though, when Mr. Simpson and you were talking about this, he was telling you that he was upset and depressed; right?

# 188 A:

No. It was more about it was a difficult time, so I think it would be a good idea to go see somebody, and I said yes.

# 189 Q:

Did he tell you who he was going to go see?

# 190 A:

No.

# 191 Q:

Did he tell you whether he ever followed through and actually saw someone?

# 192 A:

No.

# 193 Q:

When was this discussion that you had with Mr. Simpson about his seeking some professional assistance?

# 194 A:

It was probably even before the Cabo trip.

# 195 Q:

Before the Cabo trip

# 196 A:

Right around that time.

# 197 Q:

Which Cabo trip, the May or

# 198 A:

The April one.

# 199 Q:

Was it a telephone conversation?

# 200 A:

I think we were sitting at dinner. Faye and Nicole had gone to the rest room, and that is when we briefly talked, had a couple minutes' time.

# 201 Q:

So while they were gone, you and Mr. Simpson had a discussion where the idea of some professional counseling came up; is that true?

# 202 A:

Right.

# 203 Q:

Did he bring it up to you?

# 204 A:

I don't recall who started it.

# 205 Q:

At the time of dinner, did he tell you or in this discussion did he tell you whether he had done any investigation into the names of any individuals that he was thinking about seeing?

# 206 A:

No.

# 207 Q:

Have you talked to Mr. Simpson about any of his analysis with respect to witnesses that have testified in the civil case?

# 208 A:

No.

# 209 Q:

You haven't talked to him about his analysis of Mr. Kaelin's deposition?

# 210 A:

No.

# 211 Q:

You have not talked to him about his analysis with respect to Paula Barbieri's deposition?

# 212 A:

No.

# 213 Q:

You have not talked to him about Cora Fischman's deposition?

# 214 A:

No.

# 215 Q:

Has he ever taken you around the property in an effort to go through some analysis with respect to some of the physical evidence?

# 216 A:

No.

# 217 Q:

Pointing out where things were found?

# 218 A:

No.

# 219 Q:

Do you know, for example, as you sit here today why blood drops were found on his property?

# 220 A:

I have from pictures and photographs that I have seen, but no.

# 221 Q:

You have seen photographs?

# 222 A:

Yes. Whatever pops up on television sometimes.

# 223 Q:

Has Mr. Simpson ever said anything about the location of those blood drops found on his property?

# 224 A:

No.

# 225 Q:

No discussion at all?

# 226 A:

No.

# 227 Q:

No discussions at all relative to the glove, where it was found?

# 228 A:

No. I don't think so.

# 229 Q:

Or the fact that there was no blood around the glove where, according to you, one would have suspected that there would have been blood?

# 230 A:

I don't believe so.

# 231 Q:

Was there any discussion with respect to the production of the 1-800 videotape?

# 232 A:

No.

# 233 Q:

And you only looked at part of it?

# 234 A:

Yes.

# 235 Q:

Do you have your own copy?

# 236 A:

I have my own copy. It is still unopened.

KEY QUOTE

# 237 Q:

And it was given to you by Mr. Simpson?

# 238 A:

Yes.

# 239 Q:

Did he suggest that you take a look at it?

# 240 A:

No.

# 241 Q:

Did you ask for a copy?

# 242 A:

No.

# 243 Q:

Did he volunteer it?

# 244 A:

Yes.

# 245 Q:

For free; right?

# 246 (No audible response.)

# 247 Q:

Did he give you more than one copy?

# 248 A:

No.

# 249 Q:

Do you care who wins this lawsuit?

# 250 MR. LEONARD:

Objection.

# 251 CHRISTIAN REICHARDT:

No.

# 252

BY MR. BREWER:

# 253 Q:

Do you want Mr. Simpson to prevail in this case?

# 254 A:

It is not up to me to decide on who should or who will.

# 255 Q:

Well, the jury will ultimately decide but I am asking for your own personal belief.

# 256 A:

It is not my decision.

# 257 Q:

So you have no personal view whatsoever with respect to the outcome of this case?

# 258 A:

Right.

# 259 Q:

Do you think it is unfair that Mr. Simpson is undergoing a second process where he is being tried?

# 260 A:

No.

# 261 MR. LEONARD:

Objection.

# 262

BY MR. BREWER:

# 263 Q:

No thoughts whatsoever on that?

# 264 A:

No.

# 265 Q:

Have you ever talked to Mr. Simpson about whether he thinks it is unfair?

# 266 A:

No.

# 267 Q:

Whether he thinks it is unconstitutional in some way?

# 268 A:

No.

# 269 Q:

Could you tell whether Mr. Simpson, going back to the June 12th conversation, was on a hand-held telephone versus a regular phone?

# 270 MR. LEONARD:

Objection. Calls for speculation.

# 271 CHRISTIAN REICHARDT:

No.

# 272

BY MR. BREWER:

# 273 Q:

You did not hear any static?

# 274 A:

No. It sounded like a really clear connection.

# 275 Q:

Does he have a television in his bedroom?

# 276 A:

Yes.

# 277 Q:

And he has one in the den right? the TV room downstairs?

# 278 A:

Downstairs in the living room, yes.

# 279 Q:

And you have heard both televisions?

# 280 A:

Yes.

# 281 Q:

You have watched TV in both rooms?

# 282 A:

That's right.

# 283 Q:

Were you able to discern based upon the television that you heard in the background which television was on as you were having this telephone conversation with Mr. Simpson?

# 284 A:

No.

# 285 MR. BREWER:

I don't have anything further.

# 286 MS. ROIT:

I just have a couple of questions.

# 287

EXAMINATION

Temperature

tense

Key Quotes (5)

Witness

Based upon the manner in which he asked that question, it was clear to you that that person was in the same room with Mr. Simpson... It appeared to me like that.

Establishes that Reichardt believed someone was physically present with Simpson during the June 12 call, potentially corroborating or undermining alibi claims.

Witness

I think everybody was going through so many different moods, you know, there might have been a day of being depressed, there might have been days of not being depressed, not happy, upset.

Reichardt tries to deflect, but Brewer pins him down — ultimately conceding Simpson was depressed and agitated in the weeks before Nicole's death.

Examiner

Is it your testimony here that going over to Mr. Simpson's on Wednesday night with your deposition scheduled for Friday morning was a complete coincidence?

Highlights the suspicious timing of a pre-deposition visit to the defendant, implying potential witness preparation or coordination.

Witness

That years, in years past, the days when he was playing ball that he had used it sometimes.

Reichardt reveals Simpson disclosed prior cocaine use — testimony that ends abruptly mid-objection, suggesting this line of questioning was highly contested.

Witness

I have my own copy. It is still unopened.

Reichardt received the 1-800 videotape from Simpson but never watched it, which Brewer uses to probe the nature of their relationship and potential bias.

Evidence (3)

Informal

1-800 videotape — given to Reichardt by Simpson, still unopened

discussed; provenance and Reichardt's receipt from Simpson established

Informal

Blood drops found on Simpson's property

discussed informally; Reichardt says he has seen photos on TV but had no direct conversations with Simpson about them

Informal

Glove found on property and absence of blood around it

referenced by Brewer; Reichardt denies discussing with Simpson

Notable Exchanges (4)

Michael Brewer•Witness

Brewer methodically extracts that Reichardt believes someone was physically present with Simpson during the June 12 call based on the way Simpson asked about 'the score.'

strategic

Erin Kenney•Witness

Kenney challenges the coincidence of Reichardt visiting Simpson's house on Wednesday night with his deposition scheduled for Friday morning. Reichardt insists it was unplanned.

skeptical

Michael Brewer•Witness

Brewer probes whether Reichardt wants Simpson to win the civil case. Reichardt refuses to express any personal view, claiming no stake in the outcome despite their close friendship and receiving the videotape.

revealing

Daniel Petrocelli•Witness

Petrocelli introduces Simpson's prior cocaine use — Reichardt confirms Simpson told him he used cocaine during his playing days. The transcript ends mid-objection as Reichardt begins to explain why he emphasized how long ago it was.

heated

Credibility Attacks (3)

⚔ Christian Reichardt

bias

Brewer establishes Reichardt received a free copy of the 1-800 videotape from Simpson, treated Simpson for free, and visited Simpson's home two days before his scheduled deposition — all without being able to articulate any personal stake in the case outcome.

⚔ Christian Reichardt

prior inconsistent statement

Brewer confronts Reichardt with having previously described Simpson as depressed in the weeks before Nicole's death. Reichardt initially denies, then concedes it is 'possible' and that Simpson was 'at times' depressed and agitated.

⚔ Christian Reichardt

impeachment

Kenney challenges the vagueness of Reichardt's memory of the war movie he was watching during the June 12 call — he can recall almost nothing about it — contrasted with his clear memory of the phone call details, suggesting selective recall.

Witness Demeanor

(No audible response) — when asked whether the videotape was given to him for free

Objections

12 objections (0 sustained, 0 overruled)

Proceeding 9018 • 287 utterances • Plaintiff witness

Deposition Trial

Department 103