Direct examination of Richard Rubin (part 2)

📄 Direct examination of Richard Rubin (part 2) — Wednesday, November 6, 1996

Address:

C:\DEPT103\CIVIL\1996\NOV\6\DIRECT-EXAMINATION-OF-RICHARD-.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 10 of 57

◀ Sidebar: testimony scope and stipulation Redirect examination of Richard Rubin (part 1) ▶

Witness: Richard Rubin
Examiner: John Kelly
Called by: Plaintiff • Date: Wednesday, November 6, 1996 • Utterances: 344

Richard Rubin, a former Aris glove executive, continued his direct examination by identifying the two crime scene gloves (Exhibits 129 and 204) as a matched pair based on cutter number 359, sequence number 9, and shared manufacturing characteristics. He then examined a series of photographs showing OJ Simpson wearing gloves and identified each as the same style — Aris 70263 brown — based on the Brossar stitching, three needle points, blind hem, and palm vent. Rubin also gave his opinion that the gloves did fit Simpson during the criminal trial demonstration, explaining the poor fit as caused by latex gloves worn underneath, shrunken leather, and unconditioned gloves.

# 1 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Mr. Rubin, were you aware of a SKU number that was assigned to this style of glove by Bloomingdale's for sales purposes.

# 2 A:

I was aware of our SKU number.

# 3 Q:

Was that a style number?

# 4 A:

Yes.

# 5 Q:

What style number was that?

# 6 A:

70263.

# 7 Q:

And what was 70263 collective of?

# 8 A:

Well, the first two digits reflected the fact that it was a men's leather glove, and the next few digits are sequential as part of the design process. Each new design was the next number.

# 9 Q:

Okay.

By the way, do you know whether --

Do you know, in December of 1990, what the list --

# 10 THE COURT:

Mr. Kelly.

# 11 MR. KELLY:

I'm sorry, Your Honor. I'm sorry. An old habit.

# 12 THE COURT:

I don't want Mr. Kelly to feel disadvantaged by the fact I keep telling him to move over. I know it's kind of annoying, sometimes, to have somebody standing behind you talking. And I'm trying to make it comfortable for the jurors, so that none of the attorneys stand behind the jurors when they're talking.

So I'm asking all of the attorneys to stay well to the right of that last juror.

# 13 MR. KELLY:

I'm not the only one that doesn't listen.

# 14 (Laughter.)

# 15 THE COURT:

Thank you.

# 16 MR. KELLY:

Okay.

Could I have my last question read back.

# 17 (The reporter read the record as follows:)

# 18 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) The list price of these men's Aris leather light gloves was?

# 19 A:

Fifty-five dollars.

# 20 Q:

Do you know whether there was a sale going on at Bloomingdale's?

# 21 A:

On occasion, they had sales.

And yes, at this time, they did have a sale.

# 22 Q:

Do you know what the sale price of that item was?

# 23 A:

It was -- this particular sale was a 30-percent discount.

# 24 MR. BAKER:

No foundation, Your Honor.

# 25 THE COURT:

Lay a foundation.

# 26 MR. BAKER:

To this witness' knowledge.

# 27 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Do you have any personal knowledge as to whether or not the list price in Bloomingdale's for the Aris men's leather lights had been changed at all in December of 1990?

# 28 A:

On occasion, it was changed.

# 29 Q:

Well, I have to ask you, specifically, do you have your own knowledge whether that list price had been changed in December of 1990?

# 30 A:

Yes, it was.

# 31 Q:

And do you know what it was changed to?

# 32 A:

Certain times it was 25 percent off; at certain times it was 30 percent off.

# 33 Q:

In December of 1990, do you know what the percentage was?

# 34 A:

Thirty percent off.

# 35 Q:

Do you know what that would reduce that fifty-five-dollar list price to?

# 36 A:

Thirty-eight fifty.

# 37 Q:

Would it be fair to say that two pair of those gloves at $55 each, reduced by 30 percent, would be a total of --

# 38 A:

Seventy-seven dollars.

# 39 Q:

Now, I want to go back to Exhibits 129 and 204 a little bit.

Do you have those in front of you still?

# 40 A:

Yes.

# 41 Q:

When you indicated that you recognize those from the criminal trial of Mr. Simpson's --

# 42 A:

I recognized them long before the criminal trial, but I do recognize these from the criminal trial, yes.

# 43 Q:

Those particular gloves I'm speaking of.

# 44 A:

This pair.

# 45 Q:

Okay.

And did you have occasion, when you were testifying in the criminal trial, to observe Mr. Simpson's conduct, a demonstration where he was asked to put the gloves on?

# 46 MR. BAKER:

I'm going to object. That misstates the evidence.

The prosecution and the judge ordered Mr. Simpson to put those gloves on.

# 47 THE COURT:

It's a neutral question. Overruled.

# 48 MR. KELLY:

Can you read the question back to him, please.

# 49 (The reporter read the record as follows:)

# 50 RICHARD RUBIN:

Yes, I do.

# 51 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Were you able to --

You actually saw him conduct that demonstration himself, where he did put the gloves on; is that correct?

# 52 A:

That's correct.

# 53 Q:

And did you form an opinion, yourself, as to whether or not the gloves fit?

# 54 A:

Yes, I did.

# 55 Q:

And what was your opinion on that?

# 56 A:

They fit with a poor quality of fit, but they fit.

KEY QUOTE

# 57 Q:

And when you say they fit with a poor quality, what do you base that opinion on, the poor-quality aspect?

# 58 A:

They were --

They were one inch short in the wrist.

# 59 Q:

And do you have an opinion as to what would have caused them to be that one inch shorter in the wrist?

# 60 MR. BAKER:

Objection. Foundation; calls for speculation.

# 61 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 62 RICHARD RUBIN:

In this particular case, there were two issues: One was the fact that he was required to.

# 63 MR. BAKER:

I move to strike as nonresponsive, Your Honor, as to his opinion, not the issues in the case.

# 64 THE COURT:

You may state your response to the question

# 65 MR. KELLY:

Can you read the question back to him, please.

# 66 (The reporter read the record as follows:)

# 67 Q:

Were there any factors you take into consideration?

# 68 A:

The first factor was that the gloves were actually one inch shorter than standard --

# 69 Q:

Okay?

# 70 A:

-- in a north/south position.

The second factor was that there was a requirement to utilize latex linings over the hands prior to putting the gloves on.

# 71 Q:

You mean in simple terms, Mr. Simpson had latex gloves on; is that correct?

# 72 A:

Correct.

# 73 Q:

Okay.

# 74 A:

And the third issue was that the actual overall condition of the gloves, being crumbled up quite a bit and not straightened out, I would call it refurbished. It's really just they hadn't been used in a long, long time.

# 75 Q:

So when you put gloves on, you --

# 76 A:

Work them out a little bit.

# 77 Q:

To the best of your knowledge, that had not been done with these particular gloves?

# 78 MR. BAKER:

Objection. Leading.

# 79 THE COURT:

Sustained as leading.

# 80 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) And those were the three factors that you base your opinion on; is that correct?

# 81 A:

That's correct.

# 82 Q:

Okay.

And I believe earlier, you mentioned -- you stated your reasons for the apparent difference of one inch between the normal length of the extra large glove and these gloves when you measured them.

# 83 A:

Yes, I did.

# 84 Q:

Once again, what was that attributed to?

# 85 A:

Normal wear and tear, time, and shrinkage.

# 86 Q:

Okay.

Now, looking at 129 again --

Do you have that it in front of you, there Mr. Rubin?

# 87 A:

This is the left-hand glove?

# 88 Q:

Yes.

# 89 A:

Yes.

# 90 Q:

Okay. I'm going to ask you to examine that glove closely at this time.

# 91 (Witness complies, reviews exhibit.)

# 92 RICHARD RUBIN:

Okay.

# 93 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Okay.

You had a chance to look at it?

# 94 A:

Could I put my hand in it?

# 95 Q:

Sure. Yes.

# 96 (Witness puts hand in exhibit.)

# 97 MR. BAKER:

Can you put your hands in it where I can see?

# 98 (Witness complies.)

# 99 (Witness puts on Exhibit 129.)

# 100 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) While you are on this, Mr. Rubin, if you can, take a look at the characteristics we used earlier, the stitching and the three needle points on the back of the hand, et cetera.

# 101 A:

Yes.

# 102 Q:

Can you describe all the characteristics of that particular glove that you observed?

# 103 A:

One would be the unique stitching, sewing the glove completely together.

Two is this blind hem at the end of the wrist.

# 104 Q:

I'm sorry. Going back, is there a name you had for that stitching?

# 105 A:

Brossar stitching.

# 106 Q:

Okay.

I'm sorry?

# 107 A:

The blind hem at the end of the wrist. Then the other more common characteristics are the three, needle points, where there are actually three needles with thread that create these design elements.

And then there's a palm vent in the wrist.

And then there's this thin cashmere lining, ten-gauge liner.

# 108 Q:

Okay.

Are you able to tell me, after looking at all those specific characteristics, what type of glove it is?

# 109 A:

It's still 70263, brown, extra large.

# 110 Q:

There's another men's Aris leather light?

# 111 A:

Yes.

# 112 Q:

Is there a label?

# 113 A:

Yes, there is.

# 114 Q:

It says the same thing?

# 115 A:

It says the name and the size and the content and manufacturer; it does not say the style number.

# 116 Q:

Okay.

Now, have you had an opportunity to look at the inside of the lining of the glove, underneath?

# 117 A:

I did during the criminal trial.

# 118 Q:

If you recall still, are there any identifying characteristics or anything that appear on the lining of the -- the inside of that glove?

# 119 A:

There's a size marking, there's a cutter number, and a sequence control number.

# 120 Q:

Okay.

First of all, we know the size number just indicates the size of the glove, correct?

# 121 A:

Correct.

# 122 Q:

Okay.

What is the cutter number?

# 123 A:

I'm going to have to pull the lining out for a second to --

# 124 Q:

Okay.

# 125 A:

-- see that.

# 126 Q:

Sure.

# 127 A:

The cutter number is 359.

The sequence or control number is 9.

And then the XL is the size.

# 128 Q:

Now, what exactly is a cutter number?

# 129 A:

The cutter number is the actual individual who was given the leather to cut X amount of pair of this style during the manufacturing process. It was a way of controlling the leather.

# 130 Q:

And what is the sequence number, by definition?

# 131 A:

The sequence number was to keep all the parts together so that the colors matched, because they did vary across the skins. They would actually -- the cutter would say, this is the first pair; I made the second, the third, the fourth. And he would keep all the parts together. That way -- this was nine pair of that particular lot of leather that was given to the cutter.

# 132 Q:

Okay.

There was an extra large; the cutter number sequence number 9?

# 133 A:

Yes.

# 134 Q:

I'm going ask you to look at 204, which would be the right-hand glove there.

Also, if you can go through the same process, first of all, of trying it on.

# 135 MR. BAKER:

I don't understand why he's trying it on, Your Honor. I don't understand why this is relevant to any issue in this case.

# 136 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 137 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Now, while you're trying that glove on and looking at it, I'm going to ask you to examine it closely once again for all the specific characteristics we discussed before.

# 138 A:

It has the same characteristics as the other half pair.

# 139 Q:

That's the Brossar stitch and the three-point needles -- the three needle points; I'm sorry, and the lined hem and the other things?

# 140 A:

Yes.

# 141 Q:

Okay.

And are you able to tell me with certainty who the manufacturer of that glove is, also?

First of all, can you tell me, without looking at the label, Mr. Rubin, who made that glove?

# 142 A:

This is an Aris 70263 brown glove.

# 143 Q:

Okay.

Now, I see you're already doing it. I was going to ask you to look inside the lining of that glove, also, for those identifying characteristics.

# 144 (Witness complies, turns glove inside out.)

# 145 A:

Yes. The cutter number was 359; the sequence number is 9; and the size is XL, makes it a pair.

# 146 Q:

As a result of looking at those identifying characteristics of the two gloves, are you able to tell me what, if any, relationship there is between the two of those gloves?

# 147 A:

They are a pair.

# 148 Q:

No doubt about that?

# 149 A:

No doubt about it.

# 150 Q:

Okay.

# 151 MR. KELLY:

Now, if I could just have one minute. (Pause in proceedings.)

# 152 MR. KELLY:

Steve, if we could go to --

Well, before we go to that --

# 153 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Mr. Rubin, also in the criminal trial that we discussed earlier, you had the opportunity to view a number of photographs, also, did you not?

# 154 A:

Yes, I did.

# 155 Q:

Okay. Those were basically Mr. Simpson wearing gloves at different times?

# 156 A:

That's correct.

# 157 Q:

And in addition to viewing them in court, did you make some sort of independent investigation and examination of those photos, also?

# 158 A:

Yes.

# 159 Q:

Okay.

# 160 MR. KELLY:

Now, first of all, can we put up Exhibit 642, Steve

# 161 (Mr. Foster complies.)

# 162 Q:

Now, first of all, do you recognize the individual in the photograph?

# 163 A:

Yes, I do.

# 164 Q:

And that's Mr. Simpson?

# 165 A:

I believe so.

# 166 Q:

Okay.

The man you saw with the gloves in the criminal trial; is that correct?

# 167 A:

Correct.

# 168 Q:

Okay.

Now, looking at 642 --

# 169 MR. KELLY:

First of all, I didn't see -- Steve, can you put up 643?

# 170 (Mr. Foster complies.)

# 171 MR. KELLY:

Steve, it's just the close-up. I want the close-up, please.

# 172 (Mr. Foster complies.)

# 173 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) This is basically the close-up of the picture you were looking at a second ago, Mr. Rubin.

Could you examine the glove closely that's blurred on the screen right now?

# 174 A:

I can do my best.

# 175 Q:

Okay.

# 176 MR. KELLY:

Steve, can you take it back a little further, even?

# 177 (Mr. Foster complies.)

# 178 MR. KELLY:

That's good.

# 179 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) I'm going ask you if you can look at this and identify the specific characteristics of the manufacturer of that particular glove.

# 180 A:

I can see three characteristics.

# 181 Q:

What characteristics?

# 182 A:

The very fine rib stitches, which is indicative of the Brossar stitch; the vent in the palm; and then on the lower left, if you see where the shadow is, it would appear to be that the hem didn't have any stitching on it; it was a blind hem.

# 183 Q:

Okay.

And based on those characteristics, are you able to conclude the manufacture and make model and style of that particular glove?

# 184 A:

It would appear to me to be a Brossar 70263 style.

# 185 Q:

The Aris men's leather light?

# 186 A:

Yes.

# 187 Q:

And based on the type of stitching, would you be able to opine as to when that was manufactured, approximately?

# 188 A:

The bulk of the gloves that we made Brossar stitches on were made in the late '80s. So '88, '89, '90.

KEY QUOTE

# 189 Q:

That stitch wasn't used after '92, I believe you indicated.

# 190 A:

That's correct.

# 191 MR. KELLY:

Now, 655 Steve.

# 192 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) By the way, that picture that was just taken down. What color was that glove?

# 193 A:

It appeared to be black.

# 194 Q:

Okay.

# 195 MR. KELLY:

And just before you put that up, Steve, I want to ask him one other question.

# 196 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) The previous glove -- I'm sorry, Mr. Rubin. I'm going put this photo back up one more time.

I'm going to ask you, excluding color, would you be able to tell me how it compares to Exhibit 129 and 204, the gloves in front of you now?

# 197 A:

It's the same.

# 198 Q:

Identical manufacture, make, model, style, and everything?

# 199 A:

Yes.

THE COURT REPORTER: Excuse me. Is a that 643?

# 200 MR. PETROCELLI:

Yes.

# 201 (Exhibit 643 displayed.)

# 202 MR. KELLY:

Now 645. I'm sorry.

# 203 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Now, I'd ask you to look at that glove in that photo, first of all, Mr. Rubin.

# 204 A:

Yes.

# 205 Q:

Are you able to observe some of the characteristics we've spoken of before?

# 206 A:

I can see two characteristics.

# 207 Q:

Which ones are those?

# 208 A:

The Brossar stitching and the three needle points that is in the middle of the glove to the left.

# 209 Q:

Okay.

# 210 MR. KELLY:

And can you throw up 656, Steve?

Would it help for the lights to be turned off?

# 211 JUROR:

Sure.

# 212 MR. KELLY:

Your Honor, could we turn the lights off for this viewing?

# 213 THE COURT:

You may.

# 214 (Exhibit 656 displayed.)

# 215 MR. KELLY:

Little further back.

# 216 Q:

Looking at that photo, are you able to observe any of the specific characteristics we're speaking of?

# 217 A:

Just the Brossar stitching at the top of the gloves, where it goes around -- around the top.

# 218 Q:

Okay.

And based on those, I believe you referred to them as "unique details;" is that right?

# 219 A:

Yes.

# 220 Q:

Are you able to reach a conclusion as to the manufacture, make, and model and style of that glove?

# 221 A:

Both -- that is the most unique detail to style 70263, so I would say this is a style 70263.

# 222 Q:

I'm sorry. What is the most unique?

# 223 A:

The Brossar stitching.

# 224 Q:

Okay.

And excluding color, can you tell me how that glove compares to the two gloves there in front of you, the 129 and 204, the right-hand and left-hand gloves?

# 225 A:

They're the same.

# 226 Q:

Excluding color; is that correct?

# 227 A:

That's correct.

# 228 MR. KELLY:

Now, 660, please.

# 229 (Exhibit 660 is displayed.)

# 230 MR. KELLY:

Focus in a little on that glove, Steve.

# 231 (Mr. Foster complies.)

# 232 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) I'll ask you to take a look at that glove.

Tell me when you can observe any of the specific characteristics we've been speaking of.

# 233 A:

In this glove, I can see the Brossar stitching around the fingers, the three needle points down -- down the back of the glove. And then actually, it appears that the Aris label is actually sticking out, to the left bottom.

# 234 Q:

You can actually see the tag, can you not?

# 235 A:

But that is not an unusual characteristic; that just happens to be there because every Aris glove had a label.

# 236 Q:

This is sort of a throw-in?

# 237 A:

Yes.

# 238 MR. KELLY:

I'll withdraw the last comment.

# 239 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Can you actually identify that as an Aris label?

# 240 A:

I cannot read anything on the label.

It appears to be in the same location that we put our labels in, compared to other manufacturers, and it appears to be the color that we use, compared to other manufacturers. So I believe it's an Aris glove.

# 241 Q:

Okay.

And even excluding the tag altogether, would you be able to identify that from the other specific characteristics you spoke of before?

# 242 A:

Yes.

And in this one, there also -- you can see the brown tint to the cashmere lining.

# 243 Q:

And where is that, by the way,

# 244 RICHARD RUBIN:

Can you raise the glove up a little bit on the screen?

# 245 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Can you point that out, please.

# 246 A:

It would be in this area right here.

# 247 (Indicating.)

# 248 Q:

And the stitch you spoke of, what year did they stop using that particular stitch?

# 249 A:

In 1992.

# 250 Q:

Okay.

So if you had to date that glove in a particular time, would you?

# 251 A:

Bulk of it is late '80s.

# 252 Q:

But before '92?

# 253 A:

Yes.

# 254 Q:

And in looking in that glove, would you tell me how that compares to the two gloves you have there in front of you, also?

# 255 A:

Same style.

# 256 Q:

Would it be fair to say it's identical, except for color?

# 257 A:

Yes.

# 258 Q:

Okay.

# 259 MR. KELLY:

Now, if we could go to -- you can take that off, Steve.

# 260 (Mr. Foster removes exhibit from TV screen.)

# 261 (Counsel displays blow-up photo.)

# 262 MR. KELLY:

Is that better, to use a picture?

Actually, if I could hand this to the witness first, Judge.

# 263 THE COURT:

You may.

# 264 MR. KELLY:

Yeah. Take a look at that.

Can you put that 641 up.

# 265 RICHARD RUBIN:

Okay.

# 266 (Witness reviews Exhibit 641.)

# 267 MR. KELLY:

Why don't you lay it flat here for reference.

If you could, zoom in a little on the gloves, Steve.

# 268 (Mr. Foster adjusts TV screen.)

# 269 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Now, looking at that glove, both on the screen and the enlargement before you, are you able to observe any of the specific characteristics we've been discussing before?

# 270 A:

I can see the Brossar stitching on the photo.

I really can't see it on this screen, but I can see the blind hem and the points in both places.

# 271 MR. KELLY:

Get that in, Steve.

# 272 (Mr. Foster adjusts TV screen.)

# 273 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Is that better, Mr. Rubin?

# 274 A:

It is.

# 275 Q:

Looking at the photograph, enlargements from the view, are you able to --

# 276 A:

I'd like to stick to the photo, please.

# 277 Q:

Okay.

What specific characteristics are you able to observe?

# 278 A:

The Brossar stitching on the top of the forefinger at the top, and the three point, and the blind hem.

And also the characteristics of the light leather shows -- up here, where you can see the wrinkles, you can see that it's very thin.

# 279 Q:

And what color of manufacture is that glove, by the way?

# 280 A:

It's a brown shade.

# 281 Q:

That's a brown.

# 282 MR. KELLY:

Steve, could I briefly see 645?

# 283 (Mr. Foster displays Exhibit 645.)

# 284 MR. KELLY:

If you could, zoom in on the gloves a little bit.

# 285 (Mr. Foster adjusts TV screen.)

# 286 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Are you able to see the -- any of the specific characteristics from that photo?

# 287 A:

On the screen, it's a little blurry, Mr. Kelly.

I've seen the photo before.

# 288 Q:

Okay.

# 289 A:

I've identified the photo before on the screen. I'm not -- I can't say that I can identify much on the screen.

# 290 MR. KELLY:

Can we try 646 to see if it's any better?

# 291 (Mr. Foster displays Exhibit 646.)

# 292 RICHARD RUBIN:

This is better.

# 293 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Okay.

Are you able, from that photograph there, to identify the -- any of the specific characteristics we've been speaking of?

# 294 A:

I can see the fine ridge of the Brossar stitching on a couple -- on a couple of the fingers, and I can see the point.

# 295 Q:

Can you make any observation as to the hem we've been speaking of?

# 296 A:

It's a little -- it's a little dark to -- I'll reserve judgment on that.

# 297 Q:

Okay.

Looking on the photo you have in front of you, though --

# 298 A:

The hem is clear.

# 299 Q:

And what observation do you make about the photo in front of you?

# 300 A:

It's a blind hem.

# 301 (Referring to photo Exhibit 646.)

# 302 MR. KELLY:

I'm going ask you to put up pictures 645 and 646 again, see if they're clearer there.

# 303 (Witness reviews actual photo.)

# 304 RICHARD RUBIN:

Yes, I can see on both photos. I can see the Brossar stitching, the points and the blind hem from these photos.

# 305 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Okay.

If you could, just --

# 306 MR. KELLY:

Actually, let me take them back from you.

Steve, if I could see 654, please, if we go to frame 4583.

# 307 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) I ask you to look specifically at the left-hand glove in that picture, Mr. Rubin.

# 308 A:

Yes.

# 309 Q:

Can you make any observation as to specific characteristics we discussed before with regard to that glove?

# 310 A:

Yes. The palm vent is visible on the left hand.

# 311 Q:

And what exactly do you mean by "the palm vent?" You keep mentioning that.

# 312 A:

In the palm of the hand, there's usually a vent that would help a person slip the gloves on and off a little bit more easily and gives you something to pull on.

# 313 Q:

With 129 or 204, could you hold one of those up for the jury and demonstrate, if you could, what the palm vent is?

# 314 A:

This is the vent.

# 315 (Indicating to glove.)

# 316 MR. KELLY:

I've shown you -- if we could go to, Steve, 5548, 49.

If you could look at the --

Take it back down, Steve.

Stop right there.

# 317 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Are you able to make an observation -- I don't know if it's real clear -- as to the right-hand glove?

# 318 A:

It's totally blurred to me.

# 319 Q:

Okay.

# 320 (Reviewing videotape.)

# 321 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Would you agree with me that all of these photographs were the same time, place -- same place?

# 322 A:

It appears that way.

# 323 Q:

Okay.

You've seen them all before, have you not?

# 324 MR. BAKER:

Wait. I object. He is asking this witness to say that all these photographs were at the same time and the same place.

# 325 MR. KELLY:

I'll withdraw the question, Your Honor.

# 326 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Okay.

With regard to 641, once again, which would be the enlargement down here --

# 327 A:

Yes.

# 328 Q:

Okay.

# 329 MR. KELLY:

And if you could flip up, Steve, on the video once again, frame 4583.

# 330 Q:

(BY MR. KELLY) Could you state for me all the specific characteristics of the Aris men's leather light that you're able to observe between those two photographs?

# 331 A:

There are four of them.

# 332 Q:

What are those?

# 333 A:

The Brossar stitching on the fingers closing the glove down the side, the three needle points, and the blind hem and the palm vent.

# 334 Q:

And based on those specific characteristics you just mentioned, are you able to tell me with certainty what the manufacture, make, model and style of those gloves are?

# 335 A:

70263, brown.

# 336 Q:

That's the Aris men's leather light?

# 337 A:

Yes, it is.

# 338 Q:

Okay.

Can you tell me how that 70263 Aris men's leather light brown, those gloves depicted in those photographs, compare to the two gloves you have in front of you there?

# 339 A:

Same style, color.

# 340 Q:

Is it fair to say they're identical?

# 341 A:

Yes.

# 342 MR. KELLY:

If I could have one moment.

# 343 (Pause in proceedings.)

# 344 MR. KELLY:

I have no further questions.

Temperature

tense

Key Quotes (5)

Richard Rubin

They fit with a poor quality of fit, but they fit.

Direct rebuttal to the 'if it doesn't fit, you must acquit' narrative; Rubin attributes the poor fit to three external factors, not glove size.

Richard Rubin

They are a pair.

Unequivocal confirmation that the Bundy glove (129) and Rockingham glove (204) are a matched pair from the same manufacturing lot.

Richard Rubin

No doubt about it.

Emphatic certainty — this is the witness's bottom line on the pair identification, landing hard for plaintiffs.

Robert Baker

The prosecution and the judge ordered Mr. Simpson to put those gloves on.

Baker attempts to reframe the glove demonstration as coerced rather than voluntary, trying to undercut Rubin's observation — overruled by Fujisaki.

Richard Rubin

The bulk of the gloves that we made Brossar stitches on were made in the late '80s. So '88, '89, '90.

Dates the manufacturing of the gloves in the photos to the same era as the crime scene gloves, tightening the identification.

Evidence (8)

Exhibit 129

Left-hand brown Aris leather light glove found at Bundy crime scene

Witness puts on, examines, identifies as style 70263 with cutter number 359, sequence number 9, XL

Exhibit 204

Right-hand brown Aris leather light glove found at Rockingham

Witness puts on, examines, confirms cutter number 359 and sequence number 9 — declares a matched pair with 129

Exhibit 641

Enlargement photograph of OJ Simpson wearing gloves (brown)

Witness identifies Brossar stitching, blind hem, three needle points; concludes same style as 129/204

Exhibit 642/643

Photograph and close-up of OJ Simpson wearing gloves (black)

Witness identifies Brossar stitch, palm vent, and blind hem; concludes identical manufacture to 129/204 excluding color

Exhibit 645/646

Photographs of OJ Simpson wearing gloves

Witness identifies Brossar stitching, three needle points, and blind hem

Exhibit 654

Video frame 4583 showing OJ Simpson wearing gloves

Witness identifies palm vent on left-hand glove; together with Exhibit 641 confirms all four identifying characteristics

+ 2 more

Notable Exchanges (3)

Robert Baker•Hiroshi Fujisaki

Baker objected that Kelly's question about the glove demonstration 'misstates the evidence' because 'the prosecution and the judge ordered Mr. Simpson to put those gloves on,' attempting to frame it as coerced. Fujisaki called it 'a neutral question' and overruled.

strategic

John Kelly•Richard Rubin

Rubin methodically tries on both Exhibits 129 and 204 in court, examines their internal markings, and declares them an unambiguous matched pair — the clearest moment in the examination.

revealing

Richard Rubin•John Kelly

Rubin identifies the three reasons the gloves appeared to fit poorly on Simpson: the gloves were already 1 inch short from shrinkage/wear, latex gloves were worn underneath, and the gloves had not been conditioned before use.

strategic

Light Moments (2)

John Kelly

After Judge Fujisaki admonished Kelly for standing behind the jurors, Kelly quipped 'I'm not the only one that doesn't listen,' drawing laughter in the courtroom.

John Kelly

When the Aris label was visible in Exhibit 660, Kelly called it 'a throw-in' before immediately withdrawing the comment.

Credibility Attacks (2)

⚔ Richard Rubin

Foundation challenge

Baker challenged Rubin's knowledge of the specific sale price at Bloomingdale's in December 1990, forcing Kelly to establish personal knowledge before the testimony was allowed.

⚔ Glove demonstration (criminal trial)

Reframing / narrative attack

Baker objected that Kelly's question implied Simpson voluntarily put the gloves on, arguing the prosecution and judge 'ordered' him to do so — an attempt to undermine Rubin's observations about the fit by casting doubt on the conditions of the demonstration.

Witness Demeanor

(Witness complies, reviews exhibit.)

(Witness puts hand in exhibit.)

(Witness puts on Exhibit 129.)

(Witness complies, turns glove inside out.)

(Referring to photo Exhibit 646.)

(Indicating to glove.)

Objections

7 objections (2 sustained, 4 overruled)

Proceeding 8170 • 344 utterances • Plaintiff witness

Civil Trial

Department 103