Morning.

When we left off on Friday we were discussing -- we had gone up to about June 6th of 1994. Was June 6 a busy week for you?

Yes.

And when did you leave Los Angeles that week?

I believe -- I believe I left Tuesday -- Tuesday evening.

Okay. And did you take the redeye out?

Not quite a redeye. I took a 4 o'clock afternoon flight to Washington, D.C.

And what were you doing in Washington, D.C.?

I was doing a customer event for the Hertz Corporation where we bring in some of our top customers, and it was a golf tournament and breakfast meeting, and we were having that Wednesday -- Wednesday morning, so I flew out in the afternoon on Tuesday to be there for Wednesday morning.

How long did you actually remain in Washington, D.C.?

I got there, I'm guessing, about midnight. We started the event around 7, 7:30 the next morning, and I was there all day. And I believe around 7 or so I headed for the airport and caught a plane to Connecticut and got to Connecticut near midnight. I mean it was rather late by the time I got to Connecticut; it was 10 or 11 o'clock, I believe.

What was in Connecticut?

I had a board meeting the next day for a company called Fortuner. And I had -- you know, part of the board meeting is I visit the employees and take pictures, sign autographs for all the employees at the factory.

And Fortuner is the Swiss Army Watch people?

Yes, yes.

Okay. And how long did you remain in Connecticut then, O.J.?

Well, I got there that night. I was there until, I'm guessing, 12 or 1 o'clock the next day.

That would have been Thursday?

That was Thursday, yes. And then I took a limousine from there down to Long Island, New York where I joined some friends at a golf course. And I spent the night there.

Okay. And that was in New Jersey?

No, that was in Long Island, New York.

Who did you see there?

I actually stayed with a couple of friends of mine, Robert, Bobby Bender.

Okay.

And I played golf with him and some other friends that day.

All right. Now, Thursday -- that was Thursday. And on Friday what did you do?

Friday I got up, we played golf again. As the day went on we played 18 holes, and they were going to play another 18, they were trying to -- Bobby Bender, they were trying to talk me into staying but I felt I had to get back to Los Angeles.

Now, why did -- Bobby Bender wanted you to stay the weekend, did he not?

He knew I had to be in Chicago on Monday. This was Friday afternoon, and so obviously if I went to LA, Sunday I would have to head back to Chicago. So he felt it would be best for me to stay there for the weekend, play some golf with and some friends, and then, you know, go into Chicago from there and then from Chicago back into Los Angeles.

And you wanted to get back to LA; is that correct?

Yes.

And why was that?

Mainly because I had missed my daughter's first communion, and she was having a dance recital and I -- I felt I had to be at the dance recital.

Now, tell us and the ladies and gentlemen why you missed your daughters first communion?

I had, what was for us, the most important event for the year for Hertz, for my obligation for Hertz, it's called the ASTA convention, it's all -- the American Society of Travel Agents, and I had been scheduled to be a morning speaker there to 5,000 travel agents. It'd been scheduled for virtually a year, certainly for months, and people sent in cards and said they'll be there. All the other agencies, as well as hotels, as well as airlines, are all competing to get the travel agent to come to whatever their event is and hear their message. About a week before this, I was told by Nicole that my daughter was going to have her communion. So immediately I contacted Hertz to see if they could reschedule me, if I could speak the day before or the day after. The guy from Hertz said that he didn't think so because people had already agreed to come and they had some other activities with clients that they had already scheduled for me. I then called the chairman of the board of Hertz and asked him could he do something to help me, and unfortunately he couldn't.

So you were out of town for your daughter's first communion on business, right?

That's right.

All right. Now, you then flew back to Los Angeles on Friday the 10th?

Yes.

And who picked you up at the airport?

Paula Barbieri picked me up from the airport.

And the following morning, Saturday the 11th, did you go to -- what did you do?

I got up and played golf; my regular golf game. There was an -- after the golf game I came home and I guess took a nap, and -- I'm not really sure, and I had an event that I told Paula we might go to, and we -- to benefit the First Lady of Israel and to raise funds for a hospital in Israel. So I took Paula to that event.

On the way home from golf on Saturday, June 11, 1994, did you call Paula from the car phone in your Bronco?

I don't know if -- I probably did. I don't really recall. I know that night I did -- that day. I'm not really sure if I did or didn't.

Okay. Fair enough. Now, after you did in fact go with Paula to the charity benefit for the First Lady of Israel -- did you not?

That's correct.

Did you have a nice time that night?

We had a great time.

Did you have any argument?

No at all.

Mild even?

No. We even talked about this house, it was a beautiful house with a lot of rooms, and we had a conversation about filling a house like that up with babies.

Now, did Paula want you to stay with her that night, the night of the 11?

Yes.

And you went home, did you not?

Yeah. I think she assumed we would stay together. I had been out of town and obviously you assumed you would, but I was really exhausted.

THE COURT REPORTER: Excuse me?

Exhausted. I was tired.

Your Honor, I move to strike the speculation, talking about what Paula's assuming.

Overruled.

(BY MR. BAKER) Now, then you went back to Rockingham and got up again early in the morning on the 12?

Yeah.

To go play golf?

I got up, as I usually do, about 5 and got my act together. I think I may have been a little late for my group. We started our tee off time before 7 o'clock.

Now, did you have a little disagreement with Craig Baumgartener in that golf game?

Yes.

And tell us what happened?

Craig is a guy who has sort of a temper on the golf course; he gets rid of his frustration, he throws his clubs a lot. He's been reported by members of our group for doing it. On the first hole he had great shots, and everybody else wasn't in great shape, but we all were on the green in regulation. I know you don't know much about golf maybe, but he sculled his third shot over the green; it was a par 5. In any event, we all parred the first hole. Craig bogied the hole and Craig took off for the next tee, which is not unusual because when he's playing bad he normally takes off from the group. We were all talking and socializing first, you know, beginning in the morning, walking to the next tee. And he teed off before we got there and hit a bad shot and turned around and said -- said that, Juice, you're always doing this, you're talking through my swing. I said I wasn't talking through your swing, you should have waited 'til we got here. And he took off, which he's not supposed to do. You're supposed to play behind the group playing golf until everybody hits. Then I get up next and I hit a bad shot and I was a little angry because he, you know, had started an argument and he was walking off. Well, the guys were teasing me. As we went to our ball, Craig was down the fairway and I was waiting for him to get out of the way so I can hit my second shot, and when he wouldn't, I went and swung anyway and hit a bad shot, my second shot. So now I was really pissed and I went up to Craig, who was standing in the middle of the fairway, and I told him in no uncertain terms that he was, you know, sort of a butt-hole, and he said something to me, and we hit and went to the green and putted out, and on the next green we all -- you know, we looked at each other and started laughing and hugged and continued to play. My group is -- we had bets in our group for years about when will the first argument be, on the first shot of the first hole or the second shot of the second hole or on the first tee or the second tee. They normally last just like that. I mean two strokes, if you want to call it an argument. It was nothing beyond that and it was Craig who initiated it and not me. I just happened to be the focal point of his frustration for hitting his bad shot. And then he became the focal point of my frustration when I hit my second bad shot.

Now, you guys -- your usual golf group, you don't tease each other, do you?

Quite a bit.

You wouldn't rib each other, would you?

Quite a bit.

There's no bets going on back and forth?

As I said, the words, which may have been 10 or 15 seconds -- all the other guys were ribbing me pretty good about the argument and Craig once again was gone down the fairway.

Now, after you played golf on the 12th and you were going back from the golf course to your house, did you call over to Bundy?

Yes. At some point I called -- I made a few calls while I was in my car. It was tough getting through because if you drive down Sunset and you have a cell phone, your phone will ring, then it cuts out because you're going in and around Sunset. And at one point I decided to go home, and I called Bundy to inquire about, basically Justin, because I figured Nicole would be working with Sydney, getting her ready for the recital, and I wanted to know if Justin wanted to come and hang with me.

And what was decided about Justin coming with you?

Well, we spoke a little bit about tickets; she didn't know if my older kids were going, if there were tickets for them. Nicole wanted to know if I could get there early to hold seats because this event is always sold out, it's always standing room only, this recital. In fact, I guess Sean or Aaron, our nephews, were coming up. I don't recall if they were already there or coming up, but Justin was going to be playing with them, and I told her I didn't know if I can get there early. Jason was going to go, maybe Jason would get there early. It would be pretty tough for me to hold seats because everybody coming to me for autographs. As I said, it's family -- it's hard to hold seven or eight or nine seats at the recital.

That was the extent of the conversation you had with Nicole?

Basically, yes.

Okay. Now, while we're at -- let me ask you about 875 South Bundy. Before June 12, you've told this jury that you've been over there a number of times and you spent the night over there many, many times; is that correct?

Yes.

Now, the dog Kato, did you purchase that dog?

Yes.

And when did you get that dog?

Either in the late fall of -- I mean in the winter, but I can't recall if it was at end of '93 or the beginning of '94, but yeah, around that time, the fall of '93.

Okay. And that dog -- you got that dog and then gave it to Nicole and the kids?

No, I think I bought it for Justin and me, my son and I. We had just lost one of our dogs. Actually, we had just lost two dogs and, you know, Justin wanted a dog, and I wanted another dog for Chachi, so Justin and I went and bought a dog.

And did that dog -- was that dog at Rockingham at the time?

Yes, yes. Normally he would go to the other house if I was out of town. He would stay there more, but I know, being a young dog and pretty frisky, he likes to run around, and my property had a lot of grounds and her's didn't.

Now, before the 12th when -- had you had to go over the week previous and chase that dog over at Bundy?

Yes. Our dogs go out a lot; when the gate's open they're out. I had come over at -- I believe it was the Sunday. I don't think it was Monday. I'm pretty sure it was the Sunday before, and Justin was going in to get something, one of his games, and I think Faye Resnick was there and she opened the gate and the dog ran out.

And did Nicole call you to come over and chase that dog?

No. Nicole had called me just a little previous to that because both dogs were at her house and they were fighting, and I gathered Nicole was having a problem with a neighbor, and I had to come over and get the other dog. I don't know if it was a day before or two days before.

Now, did that dog Kato -- was that dog transported in your Bronco?

Yes.

And the kids were in your Bronco?

Yes.

Now, I want to go to -- after you talked to Nicole in the afternoon of Sunday the 12th, you were running around a little bit and then you went to the recital?

Yes, I was a little late. I think I may have dozed off, I think there was a basketball game, I was reading a book, and I -- when I looked up, it was just about 5, and I kind of got dressed in a hurry and went down to the recital.

All right. Now, were you in a dark mood --

No.

-- on June 12, 1994 when you went to the recital?

No.

Phil, you want to show that tape, please.

MR. P. BAKER: Exhibit 825, dance recital videotape. (Videotape is played.)

Phil, be prepared to stop, will you please.

(BY MR. BAKER) Who is that?

That's Ron Fischman.

We'll get back to him in a second. (Tape continues playing.)

Now stop it, Phil. Can we get a little clearer or back it up a bit. (Mr. P. Baker complies.)

(BY MR. BAKER) Now, who's the other man right next to you that you're talking to now?

That's Lou Brown.

And that's -- Lou Brown was Nicole's father?

Father, yes.

Okay, go ahead. (Tape resumes playing.)

(BY MR. BAKER) And that's Justin?

Yes, that's my son.

And that's Judy Brown, Juditha?

Juditha Brown. And Ron Fischman.

Now, that's Lou again?

Yes.

And stop it right there. (Tape is halted.)

(BY MR. BAKER) Right there, when you were bent over, right there, what were you -- were you in a pretty dark mood right there?

No.

What were you laughing about?

Well, Lou and I, previous to even when this tape started, was talking about women and, you know, he was teasing me and I was teasing him about his daughter and I and Paula Barbieri.

And what were you teasing about?

Well, Lou -- Judy had been walking around, talking about dinner, where was Nicole, 'cause they had lost track of Nicole, and Judy thought that they were going to dinner and figured Nicole had left them, and at one point said something to me about you're not joining us for dinner, and I said no. I told Lou, I've got to stay away from your daughter now, I have got to go back to the way it was a year ago. And we were -- we were kind of teasing about that.

Go ahead, Phil. (Tape resumes playing.)

I think that's -- cut it.

(BY MR. BAKER) Was there any animosity between you, Lou, Judy, Denise, any of the Browns, on June 12, 1994?

Absolutely none.

And was there any animosity between you and Nicole Brown Simpson?

And where did Denise sit relative to you?

We were in the very last row. Denise was in the seat directly in front of me. Next to her was Cora Fischman, and then the two Browns and Ron Fischman was in the seats in front of them.

All right. Now, at the recital, in your conversations with Ron Fischman, did you learn about the intervention with Faye Resnick?

Yes. During the course of the -- of a break in the thing, Ron Fischman walked up to me and said, boy --

Objection to anything Mr. Fischman said.

Sustained.

Well, Ron --

(BY MR. BAKER) What did you learn relative to Faye Resnick being -- having -- having a --

I'd ask for an offer of proof. This seems to be forbidden by the Court's prior orders.

Okay. Approach the bench. (The following proceedings were held at the bench with the reporter.)

We've had --

You want an offer of proof of what?

On what -- the relevance of these conversations with Ron Fischman which, under hearsay, concerning Faye Resnick's drug use.

Okay.

Well, they raised the issue of Ron Fischman. And this goes to the -- to the issue of his lack of motive. They spent a lot of time in this courtroom trying to prove that Mr. Simpson had a motive to -- to murder his ex-wife, and he, in fact, of course, in our view had no motive, and the conversation with Fischman about Resnick goes to the issue that he wanted out of this whole mess, the whole mess with Faye and Fischman and Cora and Nicole. And so I think it goes to that issue. They raised that issue when they interrogated him on the 22nd and the 25th of November.

Fischman testified about observations concerning Mr. Simpson at the recital. And there was nothing about Faye Resnick in regard to Ron Fischman's testimony, nor would that have been admissible because it would have been rank hearsay. He now wants to get into conversations that Fischman had with Simpson about things he learned from Resnick and other third parties. And apart from the hearsay problem, it doesn't seem too relevant to any issue. He really wants to get before the jury that Faye Resnick, who was previously living with Nicole for a few days, was in a drug rehab center, and raise this whole specter of Nicole living in a world of drugs.

Your Honor, just one point. This is in direct rebuttal to the inference in direct evidence that they elicited through Dr. Fischman, that Mr. Simpson was -- somehow was in a dark mood, that he had some concerns that he was -- that he was agitated. They elicited from Dr. Fischman some portions of a discussion he had with Mr. Simpson. This is his explanation, his version of the discussion. I can't -- it's obviously admissible, it's admissible on the --

We have double hearsay. We not only have Simpson saying what Fischman's saying, but Fischman is reporting what other people said too.

It's not offered for the truth. It goes to the state of mind of O.J. Simpson relative to what he did subsequently.

Even if you could get by the first level, you still have the second level.

Both go to the state of mind.

You can't get -- by Fischman learning information by talking to Christian Reichardt, by talking to Faye Resnick, by talking to his wife, whoever he spoke to, you can't get -- you can't get all that in.

Doesn't matter if it's true or not. It's not offered for the truth. It's offered for how it affected Simpson.

Finished?

Yes.

THE COURT: Objection sustained. 352. Resnick's -- conversation about Resnick is second double hearsay, and I don't see any probative value. (The following proceedings were held in open court in the presence of the jury.)

(BY MR. BAKER) Now, at the -- let me ask you this: Was Faye Resnick a friend of Nicole's as contrasted to a friend of yours?

Yes.

And was Ron Fischman, Dr. Fischman, was he a friend of Nicole's?

I would say I became friendly with him because of Nicole. So I know that she spoke to him more than I did. And she had been a -- I guess he had advised her quite a bit during the, you know, the time when she had to make some decisions about housing and stuff.

Now, during the time that you were at the recital, did you learn some information from Ron Fischman? You can answer that yes or no.

Yes.

Same objections, Your Honor. It's going to be contained in the questions rather than in the answers now.

I'm glad --

Last question and answer overruled.

(BY MR. BAKER) And as a result of the information you've learned in your being around some of Nicole's friends, did you -- did you give Ron Fischman any advice at the recital?

Yes. The same advice I had given him, oh, two or three -- two or three weeks previous, when he had a problem with Nicole and his wife and stuff.

What advice did you give to Ron Fischman?

Relevance.

Sustained.

(BY MR. BAKER) At that time, were you making any efforts to separate yourself from the friends and problems of Nicole?

Yes.

And did you suggest to him that he should do the same?

Yes.

Objection.

Sustained.

Move to strike.

Stricken.

(BY MR. BAKER) After you returned from the -- from the recital, as a result of the information you got at the recital, did you call Christian Reichardt?

Later that evening, yes.

What time, approximately, was that?

Approximately 9 o'clock.

And did you suggest to -- Christian Reichardt's relationship to Faye Resnick was what?

I gather right up till this weekend, her fiance.

Okay. And did -- was it your understanding that he had broken up with Faye?

Yes.

Did you suggest anything to Christian Reichardt that would occur in the next week or so?

Objection, same as before.

Sustained.

On what grounds, Your Honor?

Relevance, 352, hearsay.

Relevance.

Then I want to be heard on it.

Okay. (The following proceedings were held at the bench with the reporter.)

He'll testify that he called Christian Reichardt, that he said, look, I'm going to be back in town on Wednesday, let's go out and have dinner, Paula and I have a date that night, we'll go out and have dinner. Now, they spent a lot of time and effort saying that Simpson knew Paula had broken up with him, and this is to confirm that he had no knowledge that Paula had purportedly broken up with him. It's terribly relevant to the issue they spent a lot of time and effort on, and it's not hearsay, it's what he said to Christian Reichardt.

I have no objection to what he said in the conversation. But his question was about information he was learning from Reichardt and then what advice he was giving Reichardt in regard to Reichardt's problems. He wants to testify about what Simpson said concerning his plans and so forth, I have no objection to that. It's the other stuff I'm objecting to.

Sustained as to the other stuff.

MR. BAKER: I don't know what the other stuff is but... (The following proceedings were held in open court in the presence of the jury.)

(BY MR. BAKER) In the telephone conversation you had with Christian Reichardt, did you make any plans with him for that week?

Yes.

Tell the ladies and gentlemen of the jury what you discussed with Christian relative to -- what you said to him concerning your plans?

I was kind of feeling for him a little bit. I told him I would be back in town Wednesday, I had to come back in town to go to San Diego, do another Hertz thing. I would be back Wednesday night. I said then I'm going to take off with Paula and go to San Francisco Wednesday night. I'll be in town. I'll see if Paula's got a girlfriend and, you know, she's got some good looking girlfriends, maybe we'll double date, I'll get you a blind date Wednesday night and we'll go out Wednesday night. And he said okay.

Now, at this point in time, did you think you'd broken up with Paula?

No.

And you had broken up, or at least she had broken up, on several occasions, correct?

Well, I can't say we broke up on several occasions.

She said she broke up?

Object. That's hearsay.

Sustained.

All right. In any event, sir, you called Sydney that night?

Yes.

And that was also close to 9 o'clock?

I believe the calls were together.

All right.

Like, one, and then the other one.

And you made another call to -- around 10 o'clock to Paula?

Yes.

Now, did you make that from your cell phone?

Yes.

Now, did you have any cordless phones in your house at this time?

No.

Do you have any cordless phones now?

No.

And did you use your cell phone as a cordless phone?

Yes.

Now, did the LAPD make an audio analysis of that cell phone call that you made to determine whether there were any automobile sounds?

Object, Your Honor. He has no personal knowledge.

Sustained.

(BY MR. BAKER) Where did you make the cell-phone call from?

In my front yard.

Were there any auto sounds that you could hear when you made the cell-phone call in your front yard?

No.

And was there any evidence -- you sat through the entire criminal trial -- was there any evidence introduced at that criminal trial --

Objection. Completely irrelevant, what was introduced at some other trial.

Sustained.

(BY MR. BAKER) Now, from your front yard -- well, strike that. Your dog, Chachi -- we've heard about Chachi, and Chachi getting in and out of the gates -- did Chachi get in and out of gates?

All my dogs did, and -- including Chachi, yes.

Did you ever form any habit on how you would get in and out of the house -- the gates so that you would reduce the amount of times the dog got out of the yard?

Yes. As I stated before, I had been warned by the SPCA, on numerous occasions, that there had been some confrontations between Nicole and various neighbors of mine about my dogs being out. So over the years, you just develop a pattern. My pattern, is I get in my car; I start the car up; I hit the button to open the gate, and the gate opens. And as I determine the gate's about to close, then I drive out of the gate -- out of the -- out of the house.

Okay.

Now, while we're on your area, Phil. Can you get me the blow-up of the Rockingham -- the diagramatic. You remember there was a neighbor of yours, Charlie Cale, or -- were you at the custody hearings?

I was at my children's custody hearing.

All right. Now, let me ask you this: Was there anybody else besides yourself that you were friends with that had a white Bronco in 1994?

Yes.

Who?

Al Cowlings and Paula Barbieri. They were -- all three cars were about identical.

And when Al Cowlings would come to your house -- by the way, did he have a key to your house?

Yes.

Did he have a key to the gate, the front gate?

Yes.

Where would Al Cowlings park his Bronco?

Right where my Bronco was parked the morning of the 13th.

And that is by the Rockingham gate, on Rockingham, pointed north?

Yes.

And did Paula Barbieri, when she came over to your house, when -- where did she park her white Bronco?

She parked all over the place; but more than not, on Rockingham, not exactly where that car was parked. Often, even across the street, for some reason, of the intersection.

Okay. And from north on Rockingham --

Yeah, this one. I'm sorry, Phil (indicating to Mr. P. Baker.)

MR. P. BAKER: That's 1174. ( Exhibit 1174 displayed.)

Now, there's a streetlight right here, correct?

Yes.

And that's on the corner of Ashford and Rockingham, right?

That's correct.

And if you are up on Rockingham, 150, 200 feet, and it's dark, it's 9 o'clock at night or so, and you're out walking, and you're walking south on Rockingham, and there's a car parked right there (indicating), can you see it?

Objection. Calls for speculation.

Overruled.

Not only can you see it, you can see about another 100 to 150 feet beyond it.

(BY MR. BAKER) Now, there are trees in this property over here correct?

Yes.

When you're walking south on Rockingham, you can look right under those trees, because the tree trunks, they're old, mature trees, and you can see directly into your gate, can you not, if it's open?

Yes. There's many more trees now than then, but you can still see directly through it.

Okay. Now, you've gone over in some detail reports when you returned from McDonald's. I want to ask you, what were you, in fact, wearing when you went to McDonald's with Kato and got the burger and returned?

I was wearing the same blue pants, golf pants, Bugle Boy, that I had worn and played golf in that day. I had put on a -- the -- a blue -- you could call it a warm-up, I guess. I use it as a wind kind of jacket, it's -- if it's kind of cold in the morning when I play golf. And I -- I believe a white golf shirt -- I'm not 100 percent sure of that -- and tennis shoes.

And they're white Reebok tennis shoes?

That's right.

I want to fast-forward a little bit. But on June 13, after you got back from Chicago and you had been down to LAPD, did Detective Lange go up into your closet and have you identify the clothes that you were wearing?

Yes. Not only my closet, but the pants -- where I have a habit of laying the pants across my tub, because when you play golf, your pants don't necessarily get dirty, but sometimes I want them ironed and pressed. So, myself, Mr. Kardashian, Mr. Taft, and Mr. Lange went into my closet. He had asked what was I wearing, and pointed out to him what I was wearing, and took him in the bathroom and showed him the -- the pants.

And the only thing Lange took was your tennis shoes, right?

That's correct.

Okay. And he didn't ask to take any of your clothes?

That's correct.

Do you -- in '94, did you own a black sweatsuit or workout suit with a white stripe around the zipper and white zipper down the front?

No; not to my knowledge, no.

You own one now?

I have some -- my daughter bought me some -- things inside the home -- my older daughter -- they're not cotton; they're rayon or something. I think I have some pants and a cashmere coat, top, just sort of -- I use it as a pajama top.

When you left your home to go to Chicago to get in a limousine and get on the airplane, what were you wearing then?

I was wearing some stone-washed jeans, white, probably, polo shirt, and a sort of a stone-washed jean top. And I also had a wind -- I can't recall if I put it in a bag -- I had a windbreaker with me, sort of a blue windbreaker.

Now, at any time on the 12th, were you in a black sweatsuit outfit with a white zipper stripe on it?

Now, when you're on the airplane, you talked to Howard Bingham?

I talked to a couple guys. Yes, Howard Bingham.

And Howard Bingham was what, Mohammed Ali's personal photographer?

Yes.

You've known him for quite a while?

Yes.

You talked to the captain?

Yes. I talked to Craig Baumgarten's partner.

And signed autographs at the airport, correct?

Yes.

On both ends. When you arrived in Chicago, did you -- you were picked up at airport?

Yes. The guy was at the plane.

Okay. And that's this Jim Merrill?

Yes.

Now --

Yes.

Now, Jim Merrill accompanied you to the luggage detention area -- the luggage pick-up area?

Yes.

You got your baggage -- and -- at that area, correct?

Yes.

You put your golf bag and the Louis Vuitton bag back -- in the back of the car?

Yes. Yes.

Did you expect to see your golf bag between the time it was put in the trunk at any time before you were on the golf course the next morning?

No.

Now, when you go to these golf outings that you were -- you did for Hertz, you're taken care of rather well; would you agree with that?

Yes.

So what happens to your golf bag when you're picked up at the airport?

Well, this particular trip -- it differs. If the golf course is at the hotel that you're playing -- for instance, in Washington, a week before, I got there late. The golf course was at the hotel. So when you check in, the -- the bell guy takes your clubs and puts it in a golf room, and you could pick it up the next morning, or they'll send it to the -- to the golf course. And in this type of tournament, the course wasn't where the -- where the hotel was. So what happens is, they -- I leave the clubs in his car. He would have driven me to the golf course. When we get there, they -- we have these hostesses and guys, and they take your golf bag and unzip it. You can touch it. They put it in the golf cart. They take your balls out, your shoes out. They lay everything for you. My expectation on this trip would be, the next time -- once I got in this guy's car at the airport, I would see my golf clubs -- even though I didn't think about it -- but I knew when I got to the golf course the next day, all -- my bag would have been emptied and laid up on the golf cart -- on the golf cart, with all my things out of the bag.

Now, when you travel, you have -- you have your golf clubs -- they would normally -- the clubs -- the golf bag, rather, that you use when you play golf, with all your clubs in it -- correct?

That's right.

And then it has a zippered cover that goes over the top of it, correct?

That's correct.

And that zippered cover, as we can see here, because it's now in the courtroom, is considerably larger than the bag, isn't it?

Yes. (Mr. P. Baker raises golf bag in carrying case for jurors to view.)

Let's take the bag out.

THE COURT REPORTER: What number is the golf bag, please?

MR. P. BAKER: Pardon me?

THE COURT REPORTER: What number is the golf bag?

MR. P. BAKER: I'll find it in a second. (Golf bag removed from carrying case.)

(BY MR. BAKER) Now, the golf bag generally has this piece with the -- with the cover on it, does it not?

Yes.

And this also comes off, does it not? (Mr. Baker dismantles golf bag.)

Yes.

The next time you anticipated seeing your golf bag, it would have been outside of the zipper cover?

Yes.

The cover on the bag would have been off and the bag would be strapped to a golf cart?

Golf cart. My shoes would have probably either been laid out on the golf cart, or they would have brought it into the, you know, the locker room. And many times, because you play with your own balls, the guy would take out my balls and have the balls sitting on the golf cart.

Now --

Mr. Baker, do we have numbers for those?

MR. P. BAKER: I'll get it.

Is it that Swiss Army golf bag?

Yes.

That's 896 by reference. (Exhibit 896 displayed.)

(BY MR. BAKER) Okay. That particular golf bag was relatively unique, was it not?

Yes. It was the -- as far as I knew, to my knowledge, it was only given to people who work for Swiss Army. There was only about, from what I gather, 15 or 16 of them. And it had just recently, within the month, been sent to me. This may have been the first, if not the second, but the first time I've ever used it.

Okay.

And they only make -- because it became an issue in the other trial, Swiss Army only made one bag.

And that's the only bag they made, this black one with the Swiss Army on it?

Yes. Despite the fact someone said it was a different Swiss Army bag.

I'll object to what he said someone else said. I'd ask the witness not to talk about other testimony.

Sustained. That portion is stricken.

(BY MR. BAKER) Okay. And this -- the cover came with it that had the Swiss Army on it?'

That's right.

Okay. That golf bag stayed in Jim Merrill's car when you left the airport?

There was no need for me to take it to the hotel room.

You never waited for that golf bag the following morning, on the 13th, after you'd received the phone call in the -- in the hotel, did you?

No, I didn't.

Now, when you were in the hotel room and you received the phone call, did you, in fact, make efforts of your own, as well as have Kathy Randa make efforts, to get you back to Los Angeles?

Yes. Kathy started -- my second -- maybe my first call out was to Kathy to get me a flight out. As you can imagine, I was, you know, pretty -- I don't know -- you know, and I -- I just started calling, myself, also. I just started calling the airlines and people, trying to get a flight as soon as I could.

Now, after you received the phone call that you told us about 6:30 in the morning on -- in -- 8:30, I guess would be Chicago time -- did you make a lot of phone calls in that hotel room before you left the hotel room?

I believe so.

Why did you -- where did you call, O.J.?

I -- I don't -- I can't really tell you exactly where every call went, because I was calling the airlines; I was calling my house. I called Nicole's house. I believe I called -- the cell phones of -- that were given to me by the first officer who called me. I was just -- it was just tough to be sitting, trying to do nothing, so I was calling every -- I was just calling.

When you called Nicole's phone, did you get anybody?

At some point, I did, yes.

Did you get a police officer?

Yes.

Did you ask what had happened?

Everybody I called, I asked what happened, every person I talked to, that was either a police officer or my daughter or whoever, what happened.

Did you talk to Arnelle that day?

Yes.

The morning of the 13th?

Yes.

Did you ask her what happened?

Yes. Or, you know, I don't know if I asked specifically, but I was asking what's going on. And she was saying whatever she knew. And I was, you know. . .

Did you get yourself a flight to get out of Chicago, back to LA?

Kathy had gotten a 10 o'clock flight, first class. But I had found a 9:15 flight, which, as you can imagine, I -- I think there was 8:10 or so -- when I got the call from L

I didn't know if I can make it, but I wanted to get -- I had to get out of the hotel, get back to the airport, and get on a flight. And Chicago is one of the biggest airports in the world. I had a 9:15 flight. And I was about to be -- to be lucky enough to get on it. I was rushing to go get on it, instead of waiting for Kathy. My flight --

Now, you made -- and we've heard from Jim Merrill's deposition that you made two or three phone calls to him --

Yes.

-- in his car --

Yes.

-- or on his cell phone. And in his car, on the cell phone?

Um-hum.

And before you left the hotel, you were aware that he was a couple minutes from the airport -- from the hotel?

Yes. Based on my last -- my last call to him, you know, which had been maybe ten minutes previous, and he was -- he should have been driving up any minute.

And did you want to wait around and make sure you got your golf bag so you could take your golf bag home to Los Angeles?

No. I wanted to get home, to Los Angeles.

And so you got home. You got in the car and -- with Mr. Kilduff, and got to the airport?

I got the first ride that was available to me.

Were there any cabs available?

Absolutely none. We had called. I had gone back in and said where's the cab? And I think she called again said one was coming. There was no cabs around anywhere.

And Kilduff was the first available ride to get to the airport?

I don't know Kilduff, but a Hertz -- Hertz guy that I did know had showed up with some other customers and stuff. And the minute he showed up, I said, "I got to go. Can one of you guys take me to the airport?"

Now, on the way back in the airplane, did you again start calling?

Yeah. I believe also in the car to the airport, I was calling.

And who did you talk to?

You know, as I said, I can't recall who I talked to, when. I know in the hotel room, I had spoken to a police officer, who I later found out was Phillips. And Arnelle. I think on two occasions, I talked to Arnelle. I believe I spoke to -- someplace in here, I believe I talked to Officer Lange. That may have been at Nicole's house, but I'm not 100 percent sure. I didn't know who these guys were at the time. And I spoke to another officer at my house at one point, who, if I had to guess, I would say it was Fuhrman, but I know it wasn't Phillips.

All right. And what did -- first of all, did you ever express a concern about your kids?

Yes.

What did you ask about your children?

Well, the first thing I was told is that my kids were all right, and that my kids were at a police station, and that concerned me. At some point, I asked -- I don't know if it was in the first conversation or when I -- I talked to people at my house -- that I wanted to know if my kids were exposed to anything. And the guy said no; whatever had happened, had taken place in front, and they had taken my kids down the back -- down the back stairs, and that my children didn't see anything.

And were you told that your ex-wife had been murdered?

I believe the first thing that Phillips told me -- I thought he said "murder" -- he may have said "killed." But I knew when I was on my way home that she had been murdered.

How did you know that?

Because someone told me that.

You recall who?

I thought it was Phillips, as I said. Phillips, I believe the first words he told me was that my wife had been -- first he said my kids were all right -- your wife was murdered. Arnelle may have said it. But that's what I knew. I was on my way home. I knew it wasn't a car accident.

Now, did you know that there was somebody other than your wife who had been involved in the crime of June 12, 1994?

I think that I knew, possibly, someone else was a victim or also involved. I didn't know if that was for sure. That's why I believe that may have come from Arnelle, and not the police officer.

And you talked to Arnelle before you ever got on the airplane, did you not?

Yes. I talked to Arnelle twice.

When did you talk to Arnelle?

During the first conversation with Phillips. She was very upset. And we talked then. I called back at some point, and I believe I talked to another officer first, and then Arnelle. And maybe it was Arnelle. And then she gave it to another officer.

Now, by the time you got to LAX on the 13th, the media was -- had they become aware, to your knowledge, of the crimes at 875 South Bundy?

See, I was told by one of the police officers that they weren't telling the media, and so that's why I was, you know, trying not to really say anything, you know, even to the Hertz people. But by the -- I can't recall. When I got into the car with Skip and Kathy, I know that Skip had told me the police were at my house. I don't recall if they said the media was. I think we were all surprised when we drove up Rockingham and saw all of the big satellite trucks and -- and, you know, the media trucks.

About what time did you get to your Rockingham estate?

I have no idea.

Okay. When you walked up or drove up, rather, you were in Skip's car?

Yes.

And the trucks were out there with their headlights raised?

Yes. We had come around the -- went on Rockingham, and we saw the trucks. And Skip stopped and backed up and started down another street and said -- well, we're talking about should we go around the other side, and Skip suggested, should we go to the office. And I told him no; the police officer I talked to said he'd be at my house; I've got to go home. So we just backed up and drove up to the gate and tried to drive in.

And they wouldn't let you in?

No.

So what --

They wouldn't let the car in. Well, I jumped out. I believe Kathy was jumping out with me. Skip was maybe going to move the car out, once I jumped out. I just started through the gate, and -- and was stopped by an officer.

Did the officer handcuff you?

Yes. Spoke to me, and then handcuffed me.

And then what occurred, O.J.?

He was speaking to me, and he said he had to -- I couldn't go in. And then he said he had to handcuff me; he was told he had to handcuff me. And he handcuffed me. And I was asking, why are you handcuffing me? And he walked me over to this -- my daughter's playhouse. And I was just trying to act -- ask him why am I being handcuffed. And another officer, who I believe was Phillips -- he had a mustache -- was talking to me. And at some point, my lawyer came in, Skip Taft, with Howard Weitzman. And at some point, what I eventually learned is that -- Vannatter showed up, and they were saying, "Why is he handcuffed?" And they were talking. And Vannatter asked me at one point, you know, they needed to talk to me. And I agreed. And then we -- then he took the handcuffs off. And my lawyers wanted me to drive downtown with them. And there was a conversation about that. And I said it didn't matter with me -- didn't matter to me.

And you ended up driving downtown, not with your lawyers, but with Vannatter and another officer?

Yes.

Okay. Now, is this a good point, Your Honor?

THE COURT: Okay. Ten-minute recess, ladies and gentlemen. Don't talk about the case. Don't form or express any opinions. (Recess.) (Jurors resume their respective seats.)

Thank you, Your Honor.

(BY MR. BAKER) Now, O.J., when -- when you were in the police car going down to Parker Center in downtown Los Angeles, did you have your black -- you call it a grip, I call it a leather duffel bag; was that with you?