Cross-examination of Ronald A. Fischman

📄 Cross-examination of Ronald A. Fischman — Wednesday, December 4, 1996

Address:

C:\DEPT103\CIVIL\1996\DEC\4\CROSS-EXAMINATION-OF-RONALD-A-.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 25 of 57

◀ Direct examination of Ronald A. Fischman Redirect examination of Ronald A. Fischman ▶

Witness: Ronald Fischman
Examiner: Michael Brewer
Called by: Defense • Date: Wednesday, December 4, 1996 • Utterances: 58

Dan Leonard cross-examines Dr. Fischman, OJ Simpson's friend and acquaintance of Nicole's, to reframe Simpson's expressed frustration as a response to Nicole's 'erratic behavior' rather than controlling anger. Leonard also establishes that Nicole never mentioned stalking, threats, or physical fear to Fischman in their conversations, and that Simpson was smiling and laughing at the recital — not angry — when they last spoke.

# 1 THE COURT:

Cross.

CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. LEONARD:

# 2 Q:

(BY MR. LEONARD) Morning, Dr. Fischman.

# 3 A:

Morning.

# 4 Q:

Did you have any knowledge as of the time that you saw Mr. Simpson, as to what his schedule had been the week before. I'm talking about on June 12, what his schedule had been, what he had been doing that weekend, how much activity had been involved, if -- how much sleep he had gotten; were you aware of any of that?

# 5 A:

No.

# 6 Q:

Okay.

And your testimony here, in front of this jury, is that you -- when you saw him your impression was that he was tired, right?

# 7 A:

Yes.

# 8 Q:

And quiet and withdrawn, correct?

# 9 A:

Right.

# 10 MR. BREWER:

Leading, objection.

# 11 THE COURT:

I'll permit it.

# 12 Q:

(BY MR. LEONARD) Did you think there was anything inappropriate about his demeanor or behavior?

# 13 A:

No.

# 14 Q:

You also -- Mr. Petrocelli asked you a number of questions about --

# 15 MR. BREWER:

Misstates the evidence.

# 16 MR. LEONARD:

Excuse me, Mr. Brewer. Sorry.

# 17 Q:

(BY MR. LEONARD) Mr. Brewer asked you a number of questions about your impressions of whether or not Mr. Simpson was expressing some type of frustration in his discussion with you on that Sunday evening.

Do you recall those questions?

# 18 A:

The questions I was asked previously?

# 19 Q:

Yeah.

# 20 A:

Yes.

# 21 Q:

You had a number of discussions during the spring, or at least April through June, with Mr. Simpson about his relationship with Nicole and he had expressed some frustration, right?

# 22 A:

Yes.

# 23 Q:

It's true that -- that the primary reason he was expressing frustration is because she was acting erratically; is that right? That's what Mr. Simpson told you, correct?

# 24 A:

Yes.

# 25 Q:

And he told you that, for instance, he would have trouble dealing with her about the children, especially if he called her in the morning, things like that? Do you remember him telling you that kind of thing?

# 26 A:

He said that he had difficulty communicating with her, and the children were part of that, yes.

# 27 Q:

That some days she'd be up and some days she'd be down; that's what he meant by erratic behavior when he was discussing it with you?

# 28 A:

I believe so, yes.

# 29 Q:

When you were talking about frustration that was exhibited to you by Mr. Simpson, that's the thing he was mentioning to you, that's what you were talking about when Mr. Brewer was asking you questions; is that correct?

# 30 MR. BREWER:

Objection, misstates the testimony.

# 31 THE COURT:

You may rephrase it.

# 32 Q:

(BY MR. LEONARD) When you were talking about Mr. Simpson expressing frustration about his relationship with Nicole, his primary concern that led to the frustration, at least to the extent that he expressed it to you, was her erratic behavior; isn't that right?

# 33 A:

Erratic behavior was certainly the central issue, yes.

KEY QUOTE

# 34 Q:

Okay.

It sounds to me like, at least in the discussion you had about a week before Nicole's death, that she was -- she wasn't shy about talking about her problems with (sic) Mr. Simpson, she was venting?

# 35 A:

About Mr. Simpson or with him?

# 36 Q:

With him or about him. In this regard she was talking about the IRS letter, right?

# 37 A:

When I saw her, she would talk about the problem she might be having.

# 38 Q:

Okay.

On that particular occasion, she was talking to you about something that made her really mad at Mr. Simpson, this IRS letter?

# 39 A:

Absolutely.

# 40 Q:

And by the way, that would have been approximately the 6th or 7th of June, something like that?

# 41 A:

I don't recall.

I think you all have the timeline put together, and I acknowledged the date that you had ascertained as that conversation took place.

# 42 Q:

In that conversation, did she say anything to you about any stalking by Mr. Simpson, that he was stalking her, anything like that?

# 43 A:

No.

# 44 Q:

Did she say that he had threatened to kill her?

# 45 A:

No.

# 46 Q:

Did she say that -- that she was afraid for herself, physically, and for the children? Did she say anything like that, sir?

# 47 A:

No.

# 48 Q:

Now, you were asked questions about Mr. Simpson's demeanor, whether he smiled, whether he talked to Nicole. And you tried to explain a couple of times about your -- the difficulty you had in seeing or observing.

Would you explain that to the jury, why it was that you couldn't observe Nicole and O.J. for periods of time.

Can you explain that to the jury.

# 49 A:

Yes.

My -- My family had obtained seats about two-thirds of the way up in the theater. O.J. and Nicole, as noted before, were sitting in the back. When I went in to sit with my family it was a darkened auditorium, I got there during the performance. I only glanced back briefly so I really wasn't in a position to observe them throughout the performance.

# 50 Q:

And Mr. Brewer asked you very vigorously about whether, and how often Mr. Simpson was smiling.

Now, we saw on the videotape that Mr. Simpson smiled and laughed.

Do you remember that?

# 51 A:

Yes.

# 52 Q:

Okay.

And he was smiling and laughing about -- I know you don't think it was a joke, but he thought -- I guess he thought it was funny, he was smiling and laughing about your predicament at this time, correct?

# 53 A:

I think he was trying to make light of my predicament, yes.

# 54 Q:

And he never expressed anger at Nicole that night, did he, Dr. Fischman?

# 55 A:

Not in my presence, no.

KEY QUOTE

# 56 Q:

He was laughing about your relationship with your wife, and that's how you left him that night; isn't that right, sir?

KEY QUOTE

# 57 A:

That's correct.

# 58 MR. LEONARD:

Thank you.

No further questions.

REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BREWER:

Temperature

procedural

Key Quotes (3)

Witness

Erratic behavior was certainly the central issue, yes.

Leonard successfully redirects the narrative of Simpson's frustration from possessive anger to a reaction to Nicole's instability — a key defense reframe.

Witness

No.

Fischman confirms Nicole never mentioned stalking, threats to kill her, or fear for herself or the children in their conversation approximately June 6-7 — directly undermining the plaintiffs' domestic violence narrative.

Witness

He was laughing about your relationship with your wife, and that's how you left him that night; isn't that right, sir? That's correct.

Leonard ends the cross on a strong note: Simpson's last observed behavior before the murders was laughing and making light, not threatening or angry.

Evidence (2)

Informal

Videotape showing Simpson smiling and laughing at the recital

discussed to confirm Simpson's non-angry demeanor

Informal

IRS letter that made Nicole angry at Simpson, referenced in a conversation approximately June 6-7

discussed to establish Nicole was venting about Simpson, not expressing fear

Notable Exchanges (2)

Dan Leonard•Witness

Leonard walks Fischman through Nicole's failure to mention stalking, threats to kill her, or fear for her safety in their last conversation — three consecutive 'No' answers that systematically undercut the plaintiff's domestic violence framing.

strategic

Dan Leonard•Witness

Fischman explains his limited ability to observe Nicole and OJ at the recital because he was seated two-thirds up in a darkened auditorium while they were in the back, and he arrived during the performance.

clarifying

Light Moments (1)

Dan Leonard

Simpson had been laughing at Fischman's marital predicament at the recital — Leonard uses this as his closing beat, getting Fischman to confirm that's how they parted.

Credibility Attacks (1)

⚔ Michael Brewer (plaintiff's counsel)

reframing prior direct testimony

Leonard systematically recast the 'frustration' Brewer emphasized on direct as frustration over Nicole's erratic behavior, not controlling anger — getting the witness to agree that erratic behavior 'was certainly the central issue.'

Objections

3 objections (1 sustained, 1 overruled)

Proceeding 8456 • 58 utterances • Defense witness

Civil Trial

Department 103