Cross-examination of Collin Yamauchi (morning, part 5)

📄 Cross-examination of Collin Yamauchi (morning, part 5) — Tuesday, May 30, 1995

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C:\DEPT103\CRIMINAL\1995\MAY\30\CROSS-EXAMINATION-OF-COLLIN-YA.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 84 of 167

◀ Cross-examination of Collin Yamauchi (morning, part 4) Back on record ▶

Witness: Collin Yamauchi
Examiner: Barry Scheck
Called by: Prosecution • Date: Tuesday, May 30, 1995 • Utterances: 100

Barry Scheck cross-examines LAPD criminalist Collin Yamauchi about his handling of the Rockingham glove, probing for gaps in his memory of the examination process and potential cross-contamination risks. Scheck repeatedly attempted to get Yamauchi to characterize certain evidence-handling practices as 'unsound,' but Harmon's objections were consistently sustained, limiting the damage. Yamauchi admitted he could not specifically recall the order of his procedures, whether other cases' evidence was present in the room, or whether he gripped the glove with his other hand while cutting.

# 1 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Well, to my recollection, I don't recall anything like that and it's not on my notes.

# 2 MR. SCHECK:

So to the best of your knowledge, you can't tell us whether there was a piece of tissue in the notch area as well as a hair that was removed by Mr. Fung?

# 3 MR. YAMAUCHI:

There may very well have been. I try not to manipulate that item, overly manipulate it and I concentrated in on what was important to me, which was the sampling process for the DNA PCR.

# 4 MR. SCHECK:

In terms of trying to determine whether or not there could have been cross-contamination of this evidence item, would it be important for you to know when Mr. Fung touched that glove, where he touched it and what he was wearing when he touched it?

# 5 MR. HARMON:

Objection. It's argumentative, calls for speculation, no foundation.

# 6 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 7 MR. SCHECK:

Do you have any concerns that in the course of manipulating this glove, employees of SID might have transferred small amounts of blood to the glove?

# 8 MR. HARMON:

Misstates the testimony, no foundation.

# 9 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 10 MR. SCHECK:

I'm asking--do you have any concerns that that could occur.

# 11 MR. HARMON:

Calls for speculation.

# 12 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 13 MR. SCHECK:

In the course of examining and cutting evidence for purposes of DNA testing, is it important that SID criminalists engage in conduct that prevents cross-contamination?

# 14 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Of course that's important.

# 15 MR. SCHECK:

All right. Based on your knowledge of what can cause cross-contamination, would you consider it an unsound practice for Mr. Fung to have been handling the blood swatches from Rockingham and then without changing gloves, remove a hair from the wrist area of this glove?

# 16 MR. HARMON:

Objection. Misstates the testimony, calls for speculation, no foundation.

# 17 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 18 MR. SCHECK:

Would it be unsound practice for Mr. Fung to have manipulated the blood swatches and then without changing gloves, remove the hair from some location of the glove?

# 19 MR. HARMON:

Objection. No foundation, calls for speculation.

# 20 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 21 MR. SCHECK:

You don't know what Mr. Fung did in removing the hair from this glove, do you?

# 22 MR. YAMAUCHI:

No, I don't.

# 23 MR. SCHECK:

Now, in terms of your own manipulation of the glove, you conducted a number of different procedures before you even did a cutting; is that correct?

# 24 MR. YAMAUCHI:

If you're referring to the phenolphthalein test?

# 25 MR. SCHECK:

Is that one thing you did?

# 26 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Yes.

# 27 MR. SCHECK:

Now, before you did the phenolphthalein test, did you do anything else in examining the glove?

# 28 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Well, anything else like what? Could you be specific?

# 29 MR. SCHECK:

Did you touch it with your hands, the gloved hands?

# 30 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Did I touch it with gloved hands?

# 31 MR. SCHECK:

Yes.

# 32 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Yes. I would have to touch it with gloved hands.

# 33 MR. SCHECK:

Well, do you know where the--did you examine the gloves in the evidence processing room? I think you've indicated you did.

# 34 MR. YAMAUCHI:

The glove, not gloves.

# 35 MR. SCHECK:

This glove, the Rockingham glove?

# 36 MR. YAMAUCHI:

This glove right here. Yes.

# 37 MR. SCHECK:

And assuming that you did it after you created the fitzco card, do you know where in relation to the fitzco card you conducted these manipulations of the glove?

# 38 MR. YAMAUCHI:

I remember working on that glove on the--not on the table, but on the bench area next to the paper, the clean paper.

# 39 MR. SCHECK:

Not on the table?

# 40 MR. YAMAUCHI:

The table where the evidence was on.

# 41 MR. SCHECK:

So there's one--the evidence is on the table at the back of the room where the hood is, right?

# 42 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Yes.

# 43 MR. SCHECK:

All right. Incidentally, weren't there two other cases going on in the evidence processing room that day?

# 44 MR. YAMAUCHI:

I don't know.

# 45 MR. SCHECK:

You don't recall seeing any other evidence items out from any other case?

# 46 MR. YAMAUCHI:

I--I saw a lot of evidence. I don't know if it was all from the Simpson case or it could have been from some other cases.

KEY QUOTE

# 47 MR. SCHECK:

So arrayed along the tables in the evidence processing room was evidence from the Simpson case and evidence from other cases?

# 48 MR. HARMON:

Objection. Misstates his testimony.

# 49 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 50 MR. SCHECK:

Were there--was there evidence from other cases out on the evidence table out in the evidence processing room as well as evidence in this case?

# 51 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Well, there might have been. I don't know.

# 52 MR. SCHECK:

You can't recall as you sit here today?

# 53 MR. YAMAUCHI:

It wasn't something I asked.

KEY QUOTE

# 54 MR. SCHECK:

Well, I'm only asking about what you saw.

# 55 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Okay. What I saw is a bunch of packaged evidence as if it had been collected at a crime scene and it was back on that table.

# 56 MR. SCHECK:

So you do recall seeing other packages of evidence as well as the evidence in this case?

# 57 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Well, I don't know--

# 58 MR. HARMON:

Objection. That misstates the evidence.

# 59 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 60 MR. SCHECK:

Other packages.

# 61 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Well, I don't know if there were other. At that point, I didn't know if it was related or--or--if you're saying there was another case there, I wouldn't doubt it.

# 62 MR. SCHECK:

Do you as you sit here today have a specific independent recollection as to the--how far away this glove was when you manipulated it from the fitzco card and Mr. Simpson's reference tube?

# 63 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Well, that was--about 10 to 15 feet. It would be about the same as the rest of the evidence.

# 64 MR. SCHECK:

Now, did you put your initials in the wrist area of the glove first?

# 65 MR. YAMAUCHI:

No. I initialed it last.

# 66 MR. SCHECK:

How do you know that?

# 67 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Because that's my practice.

# 68 MR. SCHECK:

Okay. You don't independently recall if it's just the way you do things.

# 69 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Well, I remember doing it last.

# 70 MR. SCHECK:

And when you initialed the glove--that glove, you had to grip it in the wrist area in order to write your name, didn't you?

# 71 MR. YAMAUCHI:

I don't recall, but possibly.

# 72 MR. SCHECK:

And you proceeded to do a series of phenolphthalein tests on this glove?

# 73 MR. YAMAUCHI:

You mean after I initialed it?

# 74 MR. SCHECK:

I thought you said you initialed it last.

# 75 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Right. Well, you said "You proceeded." And so I just wanted to clarify that.

# 76 MR. SCHECK:

You--okay. Do you know where you started? Would it be in area A?

# 77 MR. YAMAUCHI:

It's most likely that I followed that A, B, C, D pattern. Makes sense.

# 78 MR. SCHECK:

All right. So you did a phenolphthalein test by taking a q-tip and swabbing area a; is that right?

# 79 MR. YAMAUCHI:

I took a clean q-tip, moistened it with sterile water and then swabbed that area.

# 80 MR. SCHECK:

All right. And then you did a cutting?

# 81 MR. YAMAUCHI:

That sounds reasonable.

# 82 MR. SCHECK:

Well, I don't know. I wasn't there. Did you do all the phenolphthalein tests first and then do cuttings or did you do a phenol and a cutting? What did you do? Do you know?

KEY QUOTE

# 83 MR. YAMAUCHI:

I don't remember.

# 84 MR. SCHECK:

Okay. Okay.

# 85 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Specifically I don't remember.

# 86 MR. SCHECK:

You don't remember. And when you did your cuttings, did you use that scalpel again with just one hand?

# 87 MR. YAMAUCHI:

When I do cuttings, I use a scalpel and yes, I can manipulate it with one hand.

# 88 MR. SCHECK:

So you--do you actually have an independent recollection that you cut the glove at every point indicated as sample cutting with just one hand without gripping that glove with the other hand?

# 89 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Might have gripped it with the other hand.

KEY QUOTE

# 90 MR. SCHECK:

All right. And you did--looking at the palm side--two phenol samplings and a cutting on the inside area labeled C in the wrist area of the glove.

# 91 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Yes.

# 92 MR. SCHECK:

And you did phenol tests, two of them, on the backside of the glove in the wrist area?

# 93 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Yes.

# 94 MR. SCHECK:

And at the end of this process, you initialed the glove on the inside in the wrist area?

# 95 MR. YAMAUCHI:

Yes.

# 96 MR. SCHECK:

Your Honor, I think that--

# 97 THE COURT:

Yes.

# 98 MR. SCHECK:

Good point.

# 99 THE COURT:

All right. Ladies and gentlemen, we're going to take a brief recess for 15. Please remember all of my admonitions to you. And we'll reconvene in 15 minutes. Mr. Yamauchi, you can step down.

# 100 (Recess.)

Temperature

tense

Key Quotes (4)

Collin Yamauchi

I saw a lot of evidence. I don't know if it was all from the Simpson case or it could have been from some other cases.

Suggests evidence from multiple unrelated cases may have been simultaneously present on the same tables where the Rockingham glove was examined — a central cross-contamination concern.

Collin Yamauchi

Might have gripped it with the other hand.

Admission that he may have physically gripped the glove while cutting, potentially transferring material — directly relevant to contamination theories.

Barry Scheck

I don't know. I wasn't there. Did you do all the phenolphthalein tests first and then do cuttings or did you do a phenol and a cutting? What did you do? Do you know?

Scheck's candid aside underlines the core problem: the criminalist's own notes don't capture the sequence of procedures, leaving the chain of custody incomplete.

Collin Yamauchi

It wasn't something I asked.

Yamauchi's explanation for why he didn't know if other cases' evidence was present — implies he was not tracking the lab environment beyond his immediate task.

Evidence (4)

Informal

The Rockingham glove — physical glove found at OJ Simpson's Rockingham estate

discussed extensively; Scheck probed Yamauchi's examination procedures, initialing, phenolphthalein testing, and cutting locations

Informal

Fitzco card — reference sample card used in evidence processing

discussed; Scheck questioned spatial proximity of glove to fitzco card during manipulation

Informal

Mr. Simpson's reference blood tube

discussed; raised by Scheck as an item that was 10-15 feet from where the glove was handled

Informal

Blood swatches from Rockingham

discussed in sustained objection context — Scheck attempted to ask whether Fung handled swatches then touched the glove without changing gloves

Notable Exchanges (3)

Barry Scheck•Collin Yamauchi

Scheck pressed Yamauchi on whether he could recall the specific order in which he initialed and cut the glove. Yamauchi initially said he initialed 'last' as a matter of practice, then was caught in a slight loop when Scheck pointed out the contradiction in his phrasing — exposing that the 'recollection' was habitual rather than specific.

strategic

Barry Scheck•Collin Yamauchi•Rockne Harmon

Scheck made four separate attempts to get Yamauchi to say it would be 'unsound practice' for Fung to handle blood swatches and then touch the glove without changing gloves. Every attempt was objected to and sustained, illustrating the prosecution's effective blocking of Scheck's contamination narrative.

frustrated/blocked

Barry Scheck•Collin Yamauchi

Scheck questioned whether evidence from other cases was present on the same tables during the Simpson evidence examination. Yamauchi was evasive — acknowledging he saw 'a lot of evidence' but refusing to confirm it was from other cases — with Harmon's objections repeatedly sustaining to prevent Scheck from locking in that inference.

strategic

Credibility Attacks (2)

⚔ Collin Yamauchi

Memory gaps / lack of specific recollection

Scheck systematically established that Yamauchi could not independently recall the sequence of his procedures (phenolphthalein tests vs. cuttings), whether he gripped the glove while cutting, where exactly he worked relative to other evidence, or whether other cases' evidence was present — undermining confidence in his handling of the glove.

⚔ Dennis Fung

Implicit impeachment via hypothetical — blocked by objections

Scheck attempted to use Yamauchi to establish that Fung's conduct (handling blood swatches then touching the glove without changing gloves) was professionally unsound. All such questions were sustained before Yamauchi could answer.

Witness Demeanor

Measured and careful; frequently hedged answers with 'I don't recall,' 'might have,' and 'sounds reasonable'

Corrected Scheck's use of 'gloves' (plural) to 'glove' (singular), showing attention to precision

Stepped down at recess without incident

Objections

8 objections (8 sustained, 0 overruled)

Proceeding 6223 • 100 utterances • Prosecution witness

Criminal Trial

Department 103