Cross-examination of Josephine Guarin (part 1)

📄 Cross-examination of Josephine Guarin (part 1) — Thursday, July 20, 1995

Address:

C:\DEPT103\CRIMINAL\1995\JUL\20\CROSS-EXAMINATION-OF-JOSEPHINE.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 119 of 167

◀ Direct examination of Josephine Guarin (part 4) Sidebar: photograph changes ▶

Witness: Josephine Guarin
Examiner: Christopher Darden
Called by: Defense • Date: Thursday, July 20, 1995 • Utterances: 529

Darden cross-examines OJ Simpson's housekeeper Josephine 'Gigi' Guarin, probing her limited contact with Simpson before the murders, her absence from Rockingham on the night of June 12, and her knowledge of the house's condition. Key areas of attack include her police statement (via a newly introduced field identification card), her claim she never saw black sweatpants in Simpson's closet, the absence of blood in the master bathroom when she left Friday night, suspicious items in the washing machine captured on videotape, and a photograph of OJ and Nicole apparently found near the bed. The examination ends abruptly at the bench when Darden tries to ask about changes made to Rockingham before the jury view.

# 1 MR. DARDEN:

Good morning or afternoon.

# 2 MS. GUARIN:

Good afternoon.

# 3 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. We met before?

# 4 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, we do.

# 5 MR. DARDEN:

You and I, we met in the grand jury?

# 6 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 7 MR. DARDEN:

And that was the first conversation we ever had?

# 8 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 9 MR. DARDEN:

And we haven't had one since?

# 10 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 11 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you are--what is your position in the Simpson household?

# 12 MS. GUARIN:

I'm Mr. Simpson housekeeper.

# 13 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you became his housekeeper in April of 1994?

# 14 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 15 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And do you recall the date?

# 16 MS. GUARIN:

Maybe second week--around after April 10th, something like that.

# 17 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Something around the second week of April?

# 18 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 19 MR. DARDEN:

And the murders--

# 20 MS. GUARIN:

But--but prior to that, I worked like on Monday just to start if I will--just a trainee, if I will like the job or not.

# 21 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. All right. So after you began as a housekeeper around April 10 or in mid-April, the Defendant left and he went to Puerto Rico, right?

# 22 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, he is.

# 23 MR. DARDEN:

He left right after you were hired as a housekeeper?

# 24 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 25 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And then he was--was he back in May?

# 26 MS. GUARIN:

I think he's back April, the last day of April.

# 27 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And after he returned, he stayed home for a day or so?

# 28 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 29 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And then he was back on the road; is that right?

# 30 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 31 MR. DARDEN:

Going to many different cities to play in golf tournaments and other types of appearances?

# 32 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 33 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And so is it fair to say that he was gone most of the time?

# 34 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, he is.

# 35 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. So you really get to see very little of Mr. Simpson or you did, right?

# 36 MS. GUARIN:

I would see him from--every time that he is in town.

# 37 MR. DARDEN:

But he was out of town most of the time?

# 38 MS. GUARIN:

Mostly.

# 39 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And so during that time period between mid-April and June 12, you really didn't see a whole lot of the Defendant, did you?

# 40 MS. GUARIN:

When he's at home, I will see him.

# 41 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Well, how many--

# 42 MS. GUARIN:

But he's--in May, he's in and out of, you know, the house.

# 43 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, you told us that normally you would have to be at the house any time the Defendant was out of town; is that right?

# 44 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 45 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. If he spent the night out of town, you were supposed to be at 360 Rockingham, correct?

# 46 MS. GUARIN:

I don't need to be there at the daytime I need to be there at the nighttime. He just wants somebody at nighttime in his house.

# 47 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Well, on the night of June 12th leading to June 13, you called the Defendant, right?

# 48 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 49 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you knew he had to catch a red eye flight to Chicago?

# 50 MS. GUARIN:

I know that he's leaving town that night.

# 51 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you knew you were supposed to be there that night, correct?

# 52 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 53 MR. DARDEN:

And the Defendant told you you didn't have to go there, right?

# 54 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 55 MR. COCHRAN:

Objection, your Honor. Hearsay.

# 56 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 57 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 58 MR. DARDEN:

Well, you didn't go to Rockingham that night, did you?

# 59 MS. GUARIN:

No, I did not.

# 60 MR. DARDEN:

And the Defendant was your employer, right?

# 61 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, he is.

# 62 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And had he insisted that you go there, you would have gone, right?

# 63 MR. COCHRAN:

Your Honor, object to the form of the question.

# 64 THE COURT:

Sustained. Calls for speculation.

# 65 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Well, you asked permission--

# 66 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 67 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. You asked permission to stay out at Knotts Berry Farm?

# 68 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 69 MR. DARDEN:

Did you ask permission to stay out there all night?

# 70 MS. GUARIN:

I asked--

# 71 MR. DARDEN:

Is that yes or no?

# 72 MR. COCHRAN:

Well, she can respond to the question, your Honor.

# 73 THE COURT:

She can answer the question.

# 74 MR. COCHRAN:

Thank you.

# 75 MS. GUARIN:

I asked Mr. Simpson if I can watch the show with my family that night and come back the next day in the morning, and he said yes.

# 76 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, you arrived at Rockingham the next morning; is that right?

# 77 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 78 MR. DARDEN:

And you arrived there at--you arrived there at about 10:00 o'clock in the morning?

# 79 MS. GUARIN:

Somewhere 9:00 to 10:00, around that area.

# 80 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you were interviewed by a police officer; is that correct?

# 81 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 82 MR. DARDEN:

And you were interviewed by a female police officer?

# 83 MS. GUARIN:

A female police officer and a man police officer.

# 84 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you told that police officer that you had talked to the Defendant the night before at 8:00 o'clock, right?

# 85 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 86 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you told that police officer that the Defendant told you not to--

# 87 MR. COCHRAN:

Your Honor, if he's reading from a report, can I see it, your Honor?

# 88 THE COURT:

Yes.

# 89 MR. DARDEN:

Well, I'm not reading from a report, your Honor.

# 90 THE COURT:

Is there a report regarding this?

# 91 MR. DARDEN:

There's an F.I. card that Mr. Cochran has had for 11 months.

# 92 MR. COCHRAN:

I would like to see it. I don't have it here.

# 93 THE COURT:

Would you show Mr. Cochran the F.I. card, please.

# 94 MR. DARDEN:

And you told that police officer that--

# 95 MR. COCHRAN:

May he hold off just a minute while I read it?

# 96 THE COURT:

Yes.

# 97 (Brief pause.)

# 98 THE COURT:

All right. Proceed.

# 99 MR. DARDEN:

And you told that police officer that the Defendant had told you that you didn't have to come back that night, correct?

# 100 MS. GUARIN:

I told the police officer that I talk to Mr. Simpson that night and I ask him permission if I can stay out and come back that morning.

# 101 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. That's what you told the police officer?

# 102 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 103 MR. DARDEN:

Have you seen a small card called an F.I. card, a field identification card?

# 104 MR. COCHRAN:

Your Honor, I object to the form of that. The cards aren't given to witnesses, your Honor.

# 105 THE COURT:

Sustained. Sustained. Rephrase the question.

# 106 MR. DARDEN:

I'm asking the witness if she has seen the card, your Honor.

# 107 THE COURT:

Right.

# 108 MR. DARDEN:

You know Mr. Cochran, don't you?

# 109 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 110 MR. DARDEN:

You've been interviewed by Mr. Cochran, haven't you?

# 111 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 112 MR. DARDEN:

Let me show you a card, a field identification card.

# 113 MR. DARDEN:

What is People's next in order, your Honor?

# 114 THE COURT:

I'm sorry? 534.

# 115 MR. DARDEN:

I'm sorry?

# 116 THE COURT:

534.

# 117 (Peo's 534 for id = F.I. card)

# 118 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, let me show you what has been marked People's 534. I would ask you to take a moment and read it to yourself and read both sides, please.

# 119 (The witness complies.)

# 120 THE COURT:

All right. Miss Guarin, have you read the other side, the other side?

# 121 MS. GUARIN:

It's only my address and nothing.

# 122 THE COURT:

Okay. Mr. Darden.

# 123 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, did Mr. Cochran show you a Xerox copy of that card?

# 124 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 125 MR. DARDEN:

No one has ever showed you a Xerox copy of that card?

# 126 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 127 MR. DARDEN:

Do you know what that card is?

# 128 MS. GUARIN:

No. This is first time I saw this card.

# 129 MR. DARDEN:

Well, when you were speaking to the police officer, did you notice that the police officer was writing?

# 130 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. She just asked my name and took the plate number of my car.

# 131 MR. DARDEN:

Is that all she--

# 132 MS. GUARIN:

And she asked me--and I asked her if I can get in the house, and she told me no.

# 133 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Let me stop you there. She only asked you your name; is that right?

# 134 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. Where do I live, my address and she take--she write my plate number of my car.

# 135 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, what you're doing right now is, you're looking at that card, right?

# 136 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 137 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And by looking at that card, it's helping you to recall all the things that she asked you, correct?

# 138 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. My phone number.

# 139 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And does this card have your phone number on it?

# 140 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, it is.

# 141 MR. DARDEN:

Does it have your weight and your height on it?

# 142 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, it is.

# 143 MR. DARDEN:

Does it have your birthday on it?

# 144 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 145 MR. DARDEN:

Does it have your place of birth on it?

# 146 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 147 MR. DARDEN:

Does it have your California driver's license number on it?

# 148 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 149 MR. DARDEN:

And did you show her your driver's license?

# 150 MS. GUARIN:

I don't recall that I saw it. Maybe I did.

# 151 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Well, looking at the driver's license number on it in the upper left-hand corner, is that the driver's license number?

# 152 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 153 MR. DARDEN:

And does it also indicate what you wore that day?

# 154 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 155 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And does it indicate that you have a nickname of Gigi?

# 156 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. That's how they call me.

# 157 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And this is all information that the officer obtained--well, most of that information was obtained from you, right?

# 158 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 159 MR. DARDEN:

This is what you told the officer?

# 160 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 161 MR. DARDEN:

And on the back of the card, it also has a description of what you told her regarding your conversation with the Defendant, right?

# 162 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 163 MR. DARDEN:

Doesn't mention anything about Knotts Berry Farm, does it?

# 164 MR. COCHRAN:

I object to the form of the question, your Honor. It's argumentative.

# 165 THE COURT:

Sustained. Rephrase the question.

# 166 MR. DARDEN:

This is cross.

# 167 MR. DARDEN:

Does the card mention anything about Knotts Berry Farm?

# 168 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 169 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. But all the other information on this card is accurate, isn't it?

# 170 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, it is.

# 171 MR. COCHRAN:

I object to the form of that question.

# 172 THE COURT:

Overruled. It is. Actually, would you reask that question, please.

# 173 MR. DARDEN:

Well, is all the other information on this card consistent with what you told the officer?

# 174 MS. GUARIN:

I told the officer that--

# 175 MR. DARDEN:

May I have a yes or no answer to that?

# 176 MR. COCHRAN:

May she answer that? May she answer?

# 177 THE COURT:

All right. Was it consistent?

# 178 MS. GUARIN:

My--the information about myself is consistent.

# 179 THE COURT:

Yes. Thank you. Next question.

# 180 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, the card also indicates that the time at which you spoke to the officer was 1000 hours; is that right?

# 181 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 182 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. 10:00 o'clock in the morning?

# 183 MS. GUARIN:

Might be.

# 184 MR. DARDEN:

You didn't tell the officer anything about Knotts Berry Farm, did you?

# 185 MR. COCHRAN:

Your Honor, object to the form of that question.

# 186 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 187 MS. GUARIN:

She didn't ask me.

# 188 MR. DARDEN:

So you didn't tell her?

# 189 MS. GUARIN:

Yeah. Because she did not ask me.

# 190 MR. DARDEN:

So the first time you told anything about Knotts Berry Farm was when you told Mr. Cochran?

# 191 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 192 MR. DARDEN:

Who did you tell first?

# 193 MS. GUARIN:

About Knotts Berry Farm? Nobody asked me about Knotts Berry Farm. They just asked me if I talked to Mr. Simpson that night, and I told them that I call him from Knotts Berry Farm.

# 194 MR. DARDEN:

You told the police officer that?

# 195 MS. GUARIN:

I did not tell the police officer because they did not ask me. They just ask me, "When was the last time you talked to Mr. Simpson?" I told them around 8:00 o'clock that night. They didn't ask me where I am.

KEY QUOTE

# 196 MR. DARDEN:

Now, you are--you take care of Mr. Simpson's clothing, right?

# 197 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 198 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And during the month of June 1994, he owned sweat clothes, didn't he?

# 199 MS. GUARIN:

Sweat clothes?

# 200 MR. DARDEN:

Yeah. Like sweatpants and sweat shirts?

# 201 MS. GUARIN:

I don't recall that he has. Oh, the things that I prepare for him, his golf pants that he usually wear and denims.

# 202 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Well, it's your job to make sure all the clothes are lined up in the closet by color, right?

# 203 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 204 MR. DARDEN:

To make sure everything in that closet is neat, correct?

# 205 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 206 MR. DARDEN:

To make sure all of his clothing is clean, right?

# 207 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 208 MR. DARDEN:

You do all the washing, correct?

# 209 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. Not all of it because some of his clothes need to bring to the cleaner. So--some of his clothes need to bring to the cleaner. Not all of his clothes.

# 210 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. With the exception of the clothes that have to be--that have to go to the cleaners, you wash those other clothes, right?

# 211 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 212 MR. DARDEN:

And you're telling us you don't know whether or not he owned black sweatpants?

# 213 MS. GUARIN:

I did not see any black pants there.

# 214 MR. DARDEN:

You've never seen any black sweatpants?

# 215 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 216 MR. DARDEN:

Never ever?

# 217 MS. GUARIN:

Never.

# 218 MR. DARDEN:

Have you ever seen the Defendant wearing black sweats in any video?

# 219 MS. GUARIN:

No. I never watch the video. Only the frogman video that I watch.

# 220 MR. DARDEN:

Well, if the Defendant owned black or cotton--strike that--the Defendant owned black sweatpants, you would know about it, wouldn't you?

# 221 MS. GUARIN:

I did not see him wearing that black sweatpants. So I cannot say that--I saw him. So I don't--

# 222 MR. DARDEN:

Well, did you ever see any in the closet?

# 223 MS. GUARIN:

I didn't see--

# 224 MR. COCHRAN:

Objection. Asked and answered.

# 225 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 226 MS. GUARIN:

I didn't see anything in his closet.

# 227 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. So you don't know whether he owns any or not?

# 228 MR. COCHRAN:

Objection. Asked and answered, your Honor.

# 229 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 230 MR. DARDEN:

Do you know whether or not the Defendant owns--

# 231 MS. GUARIN:

I don't recall if he has some or not.

# 232 MR. DARDEN:

He might have some?

# 233 MS. GUARIN:

I don't know.

# 234 MR. COCHRAN:

Objection. Calls for speculation, your Honor.

# 235 THE COURT:

Sustained. Sustained. But the answer will stand, "I don't know." The answer was, "I don't know." So the answer will stand.

# 236 MR. DARDEN:

Now, you still work at 360 North Rockingham?

# 237 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 238 MR. DARDEN:

You still work for the Defendant?

# 239 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 240 MR. DARDEN:

And his family is staying there now?

# 241 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 242 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. You watch the trial on television sometimes?

# 243 MS. GUARIN:

I only watch the trial when his family is on the--

# 244 MR. DARDEN:

Okay.

# 245 MS. GUARIN:

On the--

# 246 MR. DARDEN:

Witness stand?

# 247 MS. GUARIN:

Witness stand.

# 248 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And have you spoken to any member of his family about your testimony?

# 249 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 250 MR. DARDEN:

Now, you saw a photograph, People's 167, a few minutes ago. Do you remember that photograph?

# 251 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 252 MR. DARDEN:

You saw straps on the bed?

# 253 MS. GUARIN:

There's something on the bed.

# 254 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Did you notice what was on the bed?

# 255 MS. GUARIN:

Can I see it, please?

# 256 THE COURT:

Mrs. Robertson.

# 257 MR. DARDEN:

I have a copy of 167. Can I approach?

# 258 THE COURT:

Yes.

# 259 MS. GUARIN:

Okay.

# 260 MR. DARDEN:

Those are straps, right, on the bed, suspenders?

# 261 MS. GUARIN:

I don't know if this is suspender or strap from the bag it look like. You cannot say--you can't say if this is suspender or a strap from the bag because there is some warnings that you can--something like that.

# 262 MR. DARDEN:

Well, how many different straps or suspenders or straps from a bag do you see on the bed?

# 263 MS. GUARIN:

This is I think one. Look like only one.

# 264 MR. DARDEN:

Well, do you see something that's brown and something else that's black?

# 265 MS. GUARIN:

Yeah. There's like a black something. I don't know.

# 266 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, Mr. Simpson wears suspenders with his tuxedo, doesn't he?

# 267 MS. GUARIN:

I don't know.

# 268 MR. DARDEN:

He owns suspenders, doesn't he?

# 269 MS. GUARIN:

I usually only see the belt, but I did not see him wearing suspender.

# 270 MR. DARDEN:

You don't know whether he owns a pair of suspenders or not?

# 271 MS. GUARIN:

I--

# 272 MR. COCHRAN:

Asked and answered, your Honor.

# 273 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 274 MR. DARDEN:

Is that correct?

# 275 MS. GUARIN:

Can you repeat the question, please?

# 276 MR. DARDEN:

You don't know whether or not he owns a pair of suspenders?

# 277 MS. GUARIN:

I did not see some of it in his closet. So I don't know if he owns them.

# 278 MR. DARDEN:

Are you aware that the Defendant wore a tuxedo to an event that Saturday night?

# 279 MS. GUARIN:

I'm not there. So I cannot say that he's wearing a tuxedo or not.

# 280 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you've told us that it would be unusual for the Defendant to leave any of his clothing out; is that right?

# 281 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. He will put everything back where he get it.

# 282 MR. DARDEN:

So if he left his suspenders out from Saturday night, that would be unusual, wouldn't it?

# 283 MR. COCHRAN:

Well, calls for speculation, your Honor.

# 284 THE COURT:

Sustained. Sustained.

# 285 MR. DARDEN:

When was the last time prior to June 12 that you cleaned the house?

# 286 MS. GUARIN:

Almost every day.

# 287 MR. DARDEN:

From top--

# 288 MS. GUARIN:

Friday.

# 289 MR. DARDEN:

You clean the house Friday?

# 290 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 291 MR. DARDEN:

You clean every room in the house Friday?

# 292 MS. GUARIN:

I have a sequence of cleaning the house. One day I will clean the family room, portion of the house, portion by portion because I cannot do everything in one day. So there is a day that I will do sequence things so that I know everything is clean.

# 293 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And Mr. Simpson is a very meticulous man, isn't he?

# 294 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. But on his bedroom, I need to do it every day when he is in town.

# 295 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. All right. And so--

# 296 MR. DARDEN:

Can I have one moment, your Honor?

# 297 THE COURT:

Yes.

# 298 (Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

# 299 MR. DARDEN:

So did you also clean his bathroom every day?

# 300 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. When he is in town, I need to do it every day.

# 301 MR. DARDEN:

And you clean that on Friday; is that correct?

# 302 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 303 MR. DARDEN:

And so had there been blood on the floor of the Defendant's bathroom that Friday, you would have cleaned that up, correct?

# 304 MS. GUARIN:

I usually clean his bathroom. So I will clean it.

# 305 MR. DARDEN:

You wouldn't leave--you wouldn't leave bloodstains on the bathroom floor, would you?

# 306 MS. GUARIN:

I never see bloodstain. So I don't know how to answer that question because I always clean the bathroom.

# 307 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. There were no bloodstains on the floor when you left that Friday; is that correct.

# 308 MR. COCHRAN:

Object to the form of that question, your Honor.

# 309 THE COURT:

Sustained. It's vague.

# 310 MR. COCHRAN:

Vague.

# 311 THE COURT:

Vague as to location.

# 312 MR. DARDEN:

I'm sorry?

# 313 THE COURT:

Vague as to location.

# 314 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. There were no bloodstains on the bathroom floor when you left that Friday; is that correct?

# 315 MR. COCHRAN:

That is vague, your Honor.

# 316 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 317 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. Thursday.

# 318 MR. DARDEN:

What time did you leave the house on Friday?

# 319 MS. GUARIN:

Approximately 9:30 or 10:00 that night.

# 320 MR. DARDEN:

9:30 or 10:00 that night?

# 321 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 322 MR. DARDEN:

And was the Defendant at home when you left?

# 323 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, he is.

# 324 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And did you return to the house Saturday?

# 325 MS. GUARIN:

No, I did not.

# 326 MR. DARDEN:

Did you return to the house on Sunday?

# 327 MS. GUARIN:

No, I did not.

# 328 MR. DARDEN:

So if there was blood on the master bathroom floor on Monday morning, you can't tell us how that blood got there, correct?

# 329 MR. COCHRAN:

Monday morning, your Honor?

# 330 THE COURT:

Monday morning.

# 331 MR. COCHRAN:

He said Monday morning?

# 332 THE COURT:

Monday morning.

# 333 MR. COCHRAN:

Calls for speculation, your Honor. Calls for speculation.

# 334 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 335 MS. GUARIN:

Can you repeat the question, please?

# 336 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. You can't tell us how the blood--the blood that was discovered Monday morning was found there; is that correct?

# 337 MR. COCHRAN:

Object to the form of that question.

# 338 MR. DARDEN:

It's item 14, your Honor.

# 339 MR. COCHRAN:

Object to the form of the question.

# 340 THE COURT:

Proceed.

# 341 MR. DARDEN:

You can't tell us how the blood that was found on that bathroom floor Monday morning got there, can you?

# 342 MS. GUARIN:

No, I did not.

# 343 MR. DARDEN:

You weren't bleeding, were you?

# 344 MS. GUARIN:

I'm not.

# 345 MR. DARDEN:

You weren't bleeding that Friday, correct?

# 346 MS. GUARIN:

No, I'm not.

# 347 MR. DARDEN:

Now, prior to leaving--strike that. Is there some reason that you leave so late or left so late there that Friday night?

# 348 MS. GUARIN:

Because Mr. Simpson that Friday just got back from a trip, that Friday. So I need to prepare dinner for him before I will leave and--leave the house, clean before I go to take my day off because--

# 349 MR. DARDEN:

All right. So you would--you'd make sure everything was clean?

# 350 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 351 MR. DARDEN:

You'd make sure all the laundry was done and folded?

# 352 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 353 MR. DARDEN:

You wouldn't leave for the weekend and leave wet laundry in the washing machine, would you?

# 354 MS. GUARIN:

No, I will not.

# 355 MR. DARDEN:

Let me show you a video, just a small portion.

# 356 THE COURT:

Which exhibit are we talking about, counsel?

# 357 MR. COCHRAN:

May I see the video, your Honor?

# 358 MR. DARDEN:

A small portion of 1068, your Honor.

# 359 MR. COCHRAN:

May I?

# 360 MR. DARDEN:

The laundry or the washing machine scene, the same video we've been looking at all day.

# 361 MR. COCHRAN:

Can I see what he's showing?

# 362 THE COURT:

Mr. Wooden, do you have that cued up?

# 363 MR. WOODEN:

Yes, your Honor.

# 364 THE COURT:

All right.

# 365 (At 2:32 P.M., People's exhibit 1068, a videotape, was played for counsel.)

# 366 THE COURT:

All right. This is part of Mr. Ford's videotape?

# 367 MR. DARDEN:

Yes, your Honor. May I have one second?

# 368 THE COURT:

All right. Proceed.

# 369 MR. DARDEN:

Let me just show you a small portion of this video. Please look at the monitor.

# 370 (At 2:34 P.M., People's exhibit 1068, a videotape, was played for the witness.)

# 371 MR. DARDEN:

This is 3:01 P.M. on the tape. Okay. Okay. Stop there. Okay.

# 372 MR. DARDEN:

You didn't leave that in the washing machine, did you?

# 373 MS. GUARIN:

No, I did not.

# 374 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Did you notice what the clothing items were in there?

# 375 MS. GUARIN:

It's not here. So no.

# 376 MR. DARDEN:

You want to see it again?

# 377 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 378 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Inside and on the top?

# 379 MS. GUARIN:

Okay.

# 380 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. There's a pair of panties in there; is that right?

# 381 MS. GUARIN:

That basket that on the top of the laundry--

KEY QUOTE

# 382 MR. DARDEN:

Yes.

# 383 MS. GUARIN:

--that belongs to Arnelle.

# 384 MR. DARDEN:

Okay.

# 385 MS. GUARIN:

Maybe Arnelle did some laundry before--after I left because that basket belong to her. So maybe that's her clothes.

# 386 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. That basket wasn't there when you left?

# 387 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 388 (At 2:36 P.M., the playing of the videotape was concluded.)

# 389 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Good. Now, you told us that the Defendant was always rushing around; is that right?

# 390 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, he is.

# 391 MR. DARDEN:

And--and so--and you also told us that whenever he rushed around, he also put everything in place before leaving?

# 392 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 393 MR. DARDEN:

So is it your testimony that he would risk missing an airplane to put his bedroom back in order?

# 394 MR. COCHRAN:

Objection. Just a moment. I object to the form of that question. That's argumentative, your Honor.

# 395 THE COURT:

Rephrase the question.

# 396 MR. DARDEN:

Would the Defendant risk missing a plane so that he could put his bedroom back in order?

# 397 MR. COCHRAN:

Objection, your Honor.

# 398 THE COURT:

Sustained. Rephrase the question.

# 399 MR. DARDEN:

If you know, has the Defendant ever missed an airplane because he was at home placing his bedroom back in order?

# 400 MR. COCHRAN:

Object to the form of that question.

# 401 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 402 MS. GUARIN:

I don't--I don't know that he miss any airplane.

# 403 MR. DARDEN:

Now, you told us how you clean the house on Friday. Let me ask you this. Had there been blood in the foyer--you know--you know what a foyer is in the--

# 404 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 405 MR. DARDEN:

I'm sorry. Had there been blood there on the floor in the foyer, you would have cleaned that up, correct?

# 406 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 407 MR. DARDEN:

And you cleaned that area Friday, didn't you?

# 408 MS. GUARIN:

Prior to that, I did not clean it on Friday, but I clean the foyer area on that week.

# 409 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you didn't see any blood at that time, did you?

# 410 MS. GUARIN:

No, I did not.

# 411 MR. DARDEN:

Had there been blood there, you would have cleaned that blood up, correct?

# 412 MS. GUARIN:

If there is, I will clean it. But I didn't see anything.

# 413 MR. DARDEN:

And you didn't see any blood when you left around 9:00 or 9:30 that Friday night; is that correct?

# 414 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 415 MR. DARDEN:

Your Honor, what's People's next in order?

# 416 THE COURT:

535? 535.

# 417 MR. DARDEN:

I have a photograph--two photographs. I would like to mark one 536 and one 535, and I will show these to Mr. Cochran.

# 418 (Peo's 535 and 536 for id = photographs)

# 419 (Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorney and Defense counsel.)

# 420 MR. DARDEN:

Mr. Cochran has a question, your Honor.

# 421 MR. COCHRAN:

One of the times he wants to approach the bench.

# 422 MR. DARDEN:

I don't want to approach, Judge. I'm ready to go.

# 423 THE COURT:

Are you asking to approach?

# 424 MR. COCHRAN:

May we approach, your Honor?

# 425 THE COURT:

All right.

# 426 (A conference was held at the bench, not reported.)

# 427 (The following proceedings were held in open court:)

# 428 THE COURT:

Counsel, let's proceed.

# 429 MR. DARDEN:

May I place this on the elmo?

# 430 THE COURT:

Why don't you show it to the witness first, see if you can lay a foundation for it.

# 431 MR. DARDEN:

Let me show you the photograph that's been marked People's 536. It's a photograph depicting a photograph. Do you recognize the two people shown in the photograph?

# 432 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do.

# 433 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. One of those people, is that Nicole Brown?

# 434 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 435 MR. DARDEN:

The Defendant?

# 436 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 437 MR. DARDEN:

And is that a--I'm sorry, ma'am. Well, strike that. That's a photograph you've seen before?

# 438 MS. GUARIN:

I never see this photograph. Never.

# 439 MR. DARDEN:

You've never seen that photograph before?

# 440 MR. COCHRAN:

Asked and answered. She just answered it.

# 441 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 442 MR. DARDEN:

Well, whenever you would do cleaning, you would clean his entire room, correct?

# 443 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 444 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you'd clean up those things I have in my room called dust bunnies? You make sure there wasn't a lot of dust and stuff around?

# 445 MR. COCHRAN:

I object to what he has in his room, your Honor. That's his room.

# 446 THE COURT:

It's not surprising, but it's irrelevant. Mr. Darden.

# 447 MR. DARDEN:

I'm a bachelor, your Honor.

KEY QUOTE

# 448 MR. DARDEN:

You would make sure there were no--that there wasn't an excessive amount of dust in the bedroom, correct?

# 449 MS. GUARIN:

Yes. Yes.

# 450 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And you'd look underneath the bed and make sure everything was clean, right?

# 451 MR. COCHRAN:

Assumes facts not in evidence, your Honor.

# 452 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 453 MR. DARDEN:

Your Honor--

# 454 THE COURT:

Proceed.

# 455 MR. DARDEN:

You would clean underneath the bed, right?

# 456 MS. GUARIN:

I never clean underneath the bed. Never clean--

# 457 MR. DARDEN:

You never ever cleaned underneath the bed?

# 458 MS. GUARIN:

I'll just vacuum the side of the bed, but I will not look and clean what's under the bed.

# 459 MR. DARDEN:

You never looked underneath the bed to see if the Defendant's shoes were perhaps underneath the bed?

# 460 MS. GUARIN:

No, because I know his habit. He will put everything in place and he never leaves his shoes or whatsoever under the bed. So I will not look anything under the bed.

# 461 MR. DARDEN:

Do you recognize this photograph, 536, as showing a portion of the Defendant's bed?

# 462 MR. COCHRAN:

Object to the form of that question.

# 463 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 464 MS. GUARIN:

I don't know that picture. I didn't see it.

# 465 MR. COCHRAN:

I'm talking about the bed part of it.

# 466 MS. GUARIN:

Yeah, I saw the bed.

# 467 MR. DARDEN:

All right. That's the Defendant's bed?

# 468 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 469 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Can I show the picture?

# 470 THE COURT:

Not at this point.

# 471 MR. DARDEN:

Well, during the times that you vacuum around the edge of the bed, did you ever locate a picture of Nicole on the floor?

# 472 MS. GUARIN:

No, I did not.

# 473 MR. DARDEN:

Did you ever locate a picture of the Defendant and Nicole on the floor around the bed?

# 474 MS. GUARIN:

No, I did not. I didn't see any picture.

# 475 THE COURT:

All right. Counsel, let me see you without the reporter.

# 476 (A conference was held at the bench, not reported.)

# 477 (The following proceedings were held in open court:)

# 478 THE COURT:

All right. Thank you, counsel. Let's move on.

# 479 MR. DARDEN:

When you left that Friday night, did you leave by walking down the Rockingham driveway?

# 480 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 481 MR. DARDEN:

Where was your car parked that night?

# 482 MS. GUARIN:

At Ashford.

# 483 MR. DARDEN:

On Ashford on the street?

# 484 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 485 MR. DARDEN:

It wasn't parked up against the garage door?

# 486 MS. GUARIN:

Against the garage, no.

# 487 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. And Ashford, that's where the Defendant usually parked the Bronco; is that correct?

# 488 MS. GUARIN:

It's a big--yeah, he usually park it by there.

# 489 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. When you left Friday night, the Defendant's Bronco wasn't parked on Rockingham, was it?

# 490 MS. GUARIN:

I did not see it in Rockingham.

# 491 MR. DARDEN:

But he was home when you left, correct?

# 492 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, he's home.

# 493 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Do you know where the Defendant buys his socks?

# 494 MS. GUARIN:

What? Excuse me?

# 495 MR. DARDEN:

Where does Mr. Simpson buy his socks?

# 496 MS. GUARIN:

I don't know. I don't ask him where he buy his socks.

# 497 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, you say you spoke to the Defendant that Sunday night at 8:00 P.M.?

# 498 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I did.

# 499 MR. DARDEN:

Oh, by the way, you told us that the Defendant went to palm springs on memorial day; is that correct?

# 500 MS. GUARIN:

Yes.

# 501 MR. DARDEN:

And he didn't go there with Paula Barbieri. He went there to meet her; is that correct?

# 502 MS. GUARIN:

I don't know--I know they are together on memorial weekend, but I don't know if he drive by himself or he will meet Paula there. All I know, they are together.

# 503 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Well, do you know whether or not he and Paula Barbieri had a big fight in palm springs?

# 504 MR. COCHRAN:

Objection. Assumes facts not in evidence.

# 505 THE COURT:

Sustained. Sustained.

# 506 MR. DARDEN:

Well, did you ever have a--discuss with the Defendant his relationship, personal relationships?

# 507 MR. COCHRAN:

Objection. Goes beyond the scope of my examination.

# 508 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 509 MS. GUARIN:

Discussing his relationship, no.

# 510 MR. DARDEN:

So you wouldn't know--

# 511 MR. COCHRAN:

I object to this question, your Honor, based upon she said she wouldn't know.

# 512 THE COURT:

Overruled. She's indicated she didn't discuss his personal relationships.

# 513 MR. DARDEN:

Did you know the Defendant in 1989?

# 514 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 515 MR. DARDEN:

Did you know him in October of 1993?

# 516 MS. GUARIN:

No.

# 517 MR. DARDEN:

I just have a few more questions, your Honor. If I could have one moment.

# 518 (Brief pause.)

# 519 MR. DARDEN:

As part of keeping the house clean, you would--you would clean all the pictures, right? You'd dust the pictures off?

# 520 MS. GUARIN:

Sometimes if they need to be dust, I will do that.

# 521 MR. DARDEN:

Okay. Now, you understand that the jury had a jury view of 360 North Rockingham; is that correct?

# 522 MS. GUARIN:

Yes, I do. I'm there.

# 523 MR. DARDEN:

Now, you made some additions or some changes--

# 524 MR. COCHRAN:

Your Honor, I object to the form of that question. May we approach?

# 525 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 526 MR. DARDEN:

Is that due to foundation or--

# 527 THE COURT:

I'm going to sustain the objection at this point.

# 528 MR. DARDEN:

Is that to any questions regarding the jury view prep--should I come up with--

# 529 THE COURT:

With the court reporter.

Temperature

tense

Key Quotes (5)

Josephine Guarin

I did not tell the police officer because they did not ask me. They just ask me, 'When was the last time you talked to Mr. Simpson?' I told them around 8:00 o'clock that night. They didn't ask me where I am.

Explains why Knotts Berry Farm never appeared in her police statement — a distinction Darden is trying to undermine by showing the omission is suspicious.

Josephine Guarin

I never see any black pants there. Never.

Flat denial that Simpson owned black sweatpants — relevant to the prosecution theory about what he wore during the murders.

Josephine Guarin

I will not look anything under the bed.

Sets up Darden's implied point that a photograph of OJ and Nicole could have been there without her knowledge.

Christopher Darden

I'm a bachelor, your Honor.

Self-deprecating aside after Ito called his dust-bunnies reference irrelevant; provided rare comic relief.

Josephine Guarin

That basket that on the top of the laundry — that belongs to Arnelle. Maybe Arnelle did some laundry before — after I left because that basket belong to her.

Spontaneous explanation for laundry in washing machine shown on the post-crime videotape; suggests someone else was doing laundry at Rockingham after the murders.

Evidence (5)

People's 534

Field identification card filled out by a police officer when Guarin arrived at Rockingham the morning of June 13, containing her personal details and a description of her conversation with Simpson the night before

introduced and used to impeach — no mention of Knotts Berry Farm, no mention that Simpson told her not to come home

People's 1068

Videotape (described as Ford's videotape) of the Rockingham house post-murders, including a scene at 3:01 PM showing the washing machine with laundry and Arnelle's basket on top

played for witness to challenge her claim she would never leave wet laundry behind

People's 167

Photograph of the Defendant's bed showing what appear to be straps or suspenders

shown to witness; she said the items could be a strap from a bag, couldn't confirm suspenders

People's 536

Photograph depicting a photograph — shows OJ Simpson and Nicole Brown together, apparently found at or near the bed

shown to witness for foundation; Guarin confirmed recognizing the subjects but said she had never seen the photograph before; judge declined to show to jury at this point

People's 535

Photograph (companion to 536, details not fully revealed in this portion)

marked for identification; bench conference held before use

Notable Exchanges (5)

Christopher Darden•Josephine Guarin

Darden walks Guarin through the F.I. card field by field — height, weight, DOB, driver's license, nickname 'Gigi,' clothing she wore — getting her to confirm its accuracy, then lands on the back of the card which describes her conversation with Simpson but does not mention Knotts Berry Farm.

strategic

Christopher Darden•Josephine Guarin

Darden establishes that the bathroom was clean when Guarin left Friday night and that she was not there Saturday or Sunday, then asks her directly whether she can explain how blood found on the bathroom floor Monday morning got there.

revealing

Christopher Darden•Josephine Guarin

Darden plays videotape of the washing machine, asking Guarin if she left laundry behind. She denies it and volunteers that the basket on top belongs to Arnelle, who may have done laundry after she left.

strategic

Johnnie Cochran•Lance A. Ito•Christopher Darden

Cochran demands to see the F.I. card before Darden can use it, claiming he does not have a copy. Darden fires back that Cochran has had it for 11 months.

heated

Christopher Darden•Lance A. Ito

Darden attempts to question Guarin about changes made to Rockingham before the jury view; Cochran objects and they go to the bench unreported. The line of questioning is blocked.

procedural

Light Moments (1)

Christopher Darden

After Cochran objected to Darden's reference to 'dust bunnies' in his own room, Ito called it irrelevant. Darden responded deadpan: 'I'm a bachelor, your Honor.'

Credibility Attacks (3)

⚔ Josephine Guarin

prior inconsistent statement / omission

Darden introduced the F.I. card (People's 534) from Guarin's June 13 police interview to show that she never mentioned Knotts Berry Farm or that Simpson told her she didn't have to return — details that only appeared later after she spoke with Cochran.

⚔ Josephine Guarin

bias / employment relationship

Darden repeatedly emphasized that Guarin still works for Simpson and lives in his household, implying her testimony is shaped by that ongoing dependency.

⚔ Josephine Guarin

limited observation

Darden established that Simpson was out of town most of the time between mid-April and June 12, undermining her ability to offer reliable testimony about his habits, clothing, and possessions.

Witness Demeanor

(The witness complies.) — reads both sides of the F.I. card as instructed

Repeatedly asks 'Can you repeat the question, please?' — suggests careful, cautious answering

Spontaneously volunteers explanations beyond yes/no (Knotts Berry Farm, Arnelle's laundry basket) — engaged and protective of Simpson

Objections

26 objections (9 sustained, 16 overruled)

Proceeding 6958 • 529 utterances • Defense witness

Criminal Trial

Department 103