Louis Karpf, Nicole Brown Simpson's next-door neighbor at 873 South Bundy, testified that he returned home from San Jose around 10:45–11:00 PM on June 12, 1994, and immediately encountered Nicole's Akita barking loudly and running loose in the street. He also noticed an unknown male Caucasian walking a separate dog northbound on the east side of Bundy. Cochran's cross-examination focused on pushing Karpf's arrival time slightly later (toward 10:50–11:00 per police report) and establishing that Karpf never looked toward 875 Bundy and could not have seen anything there.
# 1 MS. CLARK: THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR. PEOPLE CALL LOUIS KARPF. THE COURT: MADAM REPORTER, HOW'S YOUR PAPER SUPPLY?
# 2 THE COURT REPORTER: FINE.
# 3 THE COURT: HOW DOES 10:30 SOUND?
# 4 THE COURT REPORTER: THAT'S FINE.
# 5 THE COURT: MR. KARPF, STEP OVER HERE, PLEASE, BY THE COURT REPORTER. WHY DON'T YOU FACE THE CLERK.
LOUIS KARPF, CALLED AS A WITNESS BY THE PEOPLE, WAS SWORN AND TESTIFIED AS FOLLOWS:
# 6 THE CLERK: RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND, PLEASE. YOU DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR THAT THE TESTIMONY YOU MAY GIVE IN THE CAUSE NOW PENDING BEFORE THIS COURT, SHALL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH, SO HELP YOU GOD?
# 7 LOUIS KARPF: YES, I DO.
# 8 THE CLERK: PLEASE HAVE A SEAT IN THE WITNESS STAND AND STATE AND SPELL YOUR FIRST AND LAST NAMES FOR THE RECORD.
# 9 LOUIS KARPF: MY NAME IS LOUIS KARPF, THAT'S L-O-U-I-S K-A-R-P-F.
# 10 THE COURT: MISS CLARK, DON'T TRIP OVER THE BAG THERE.
# 11 MS. CLARK: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. RIGHT HERE.
# 14 Q: GOOD MORNING, MR. KARPF.
# 16 Q: SIR, DIRECTING YOUR ATTENTION TO THE DATE OF JUNE THE 12TH, 1994, AS OF THAT DATE, SIR, WHERE WERE YOU LIVING?
# 17 A: I WAS LIVING AT 873 SOUTH BUNDY DRIVE.
# 18 Q: AND WHERE WOULD THAT BE IN RELATION TO 875 SOUTH BUNDY?
# 19 A: THAT IS THE NEXT CONDOMINIUM NORTH OF THAT UNIT.
# 20 Q: SO 875 SOUTH BUNDY WOULD BE JUST SOUTH OF YOU?
# 21 A: JUST SOUTH OF ME.
# 24 Q: I ASK YOU TO TURN AND LOOK AT THE EXHIBIT THAT'S BEEN MARKED AS PEOPLE'S 26 AND TAKE THE POINTER, AND JUST TO ORIENTATE YOU, IF THIS RED SQUARE HERE WAS 875 SOUTH BUNDY, WHAT WOULD THAT BLUE SQUARE BE (INDICATING)?
# 25 A: IT WOULD BE THE UNIT THAT I LIVED IN.
# 28 THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. JUROR 1492, COULD YOU HEAR THAT ANSWER?
JUROR NO. 1492: YES.
# 29 THE COURT: THANK YOU.
# 30 Q: BY MS. CLARK: I'M GOING TO ASK YOU, SIR, TO LOOK AT THE MONITOR TO YOUR RIGHT. LOOK DOWN. THERE YOU GO. DO YOU RECOGNIZE THE LOCATION THAT'S SHOWN THERE IN THAT PHOTOGRAPH?
# 32 Q: YOU SEE THAT MOVING CROSS?
# 34 Q: FIRST OF ALL, I'M GOING TO SHOW WITH THE CROSS --
# 35 MS. CLARK: JONATHAN, COULD YOU PUT IT ON THE JEEP? THANK YOU.
# 36 Q: BY MS. CLARK: IF THAT CROSS IS NOW AT A JEEP THAT'S PARKED AT 875 SOUTH BUNDY, COULD YOU PLEASE TELL THE JURY WHERE YOUR UNIT WOULD HAVE BEEN IN RELATION TO THAT?
# 37 A: JUST NORTH OF THAT.
# 38 Q: WOULD THAT BE WHERE IT'S INDICATED WITH A CROSS?
# 41 MS. CLARK: CAN YOU PRINT --
# 42 THE COURT: NOW AN X.
# 43 MS. CLARK: NOW AN X. AND I THINK -- WE ARE GOING TO PUT THE INITIALS OF THE -- EXCUSE ME, COUNSEL. I'M SORRY?
# 44 (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND DEFENSE COUNSEL.) # 45 MS. CLARK: CAN WE PUT AN LK AT THE TOP OF THE VERY, VERY, VERY TOP IN THE CENTER OR -- THAT'S FINE. THANK YOU, JOHN.
# 46 Q: BY MS. CLARK: ALL RIGHT. NOW, DO YOU HAVE AN ENTRANCE THAT OPENS OUT ONTO THAT ALLEY, SIR?
# 47 A: MY GARAGE OPENS OUT INTO THE ALLEY.
# 48 Q: DO YOU USE THAT GARAGE TO GO IN AND OUT OF YOUR APARTMENT?
# 50 Q: AND AS OF JUNE THE 12TH, 1994, SIR, HOW LONG HAD YOU BEEN LIVING THERE?
# 51 A: IT WOULD BE ABOUT FOUR AND A HALF YEARS.
# 52 Q: DID YOU EVER KNOW WHO WAS LIVING AT 875 SOUTH BUNDY IN JUNE OF 1994?
# 54 Q: AND WHO WAS THAT?
# 55 A: NICOLE SIMPSON BROWN.
# 56 Q: AND DID YOU KNOW SHE HAD A DOG?
# 57 A: I HEARD IT ON OCCASION. NEVER SAW IT.
# 58 Q: YOU OCCASIONALLY HEARD IT BARKING?
# 60 Q: ON THE DATE OF JUNE THE 12TH, 1994, SIR, WERE YOU IN YOUR -- WERE YOU IN LOS ANGELES?
# 63 A: I WAS IN SAN JOSE.
# 64 Q: DID YOU RETURN SOMETIME THAT NIGHT?
# 67 A: I GOT HOME APPROXIMATELY QUARTER TO 11:00 AT NIGHT.
# 68 Q: WHAT -- WELL, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?
# 69 A: WELL, I KNOW WHAT TIME MY FLIGHT APPROXIMATELY TOOK OFF, AND THAT WAS LATE, AND I'M AWARE OF THE TIME WHEN I -- YOU KNOW, I WAS IN A HURRY TO GET HOME, SO I KNOW IT WAS LATE. I SHOULD HAVE BEEN HOME AT LEAST A HALF HOUR EARLIER.
# 70 Q: SO WHAT TIME DID YOUR FLIGHT LAND?
# 71 A: IT LANDED APPROXIMATELY 10:00 P.M.
# 72 Q: AND SO -- DO YOU TAKE THAT FLIGHT OFTEN FROM SAN JOSE TO LOS ANGELES?
# 73 A: I WOULD SAY TWO TO FOUR TIMES A YEAR.
# 74 Q: OKAY. DO YOU DO A LOT OF FLYING?
# 76 Q: HAVE YOU LANDED AT LAX BEFORE?
# 78 Q: AND HAVE YOU DRIVEN FROM THE LAX PARKING LOT TO YOUR HOME ON BUNDY MANY TIMES?
# 80 Q: AND ARE YOU VERY FAMILIAR WITH HOW LONG IT TAKES YOU TO GET TO THE AIRPORT PARKING LOT AND FROM THERE TO YOUR HOME?
# 82 Q: SO YOUR FLIGHT LANDED AT 10:00 O'CLOCK THAT NIGHT?
# 84 Q: AND THEN YOU GOT TO THE AIRPORT PARKING LOT ABOUT WHAT TIME?
# 85 A: I WOULD SAY NO LATER THAN 10:15.
# 86 Q: AND FROM THERE, YOU HAD TO DRIVE HOME?
# 88 Q: AND THAT TAKES YOU HOW LONG?
# 89 A: 20 MINUTES TO HALF HOUR MAXIMUM.
# 90 Q: AND SO THAT NIGHT, HOW LONG DID IT TAKE YOU TO GET HOME FROM THE AIRPORT PARKING LOT AT 10:15?
# 91 A: I WOULD SAY WITHIN THAT PERIOD OF 20 MINUTES TO HALF HOUR.
# 92 Q: SO YOU GOT HOME NO LATER THAN 10:45?
# 94 Q: WHAT DID YOU DO WHEN YOU GOT HOME, SIR?
# 95 A: FIRST THING I DID, I WENT OUT TO RETRIEVE MY MAIL, WHICH IS OUT TOWARDS BUNDY.
# 96 Q: LET ME BACK UP FOR A MINUTE. I WANTED TO ASK YOU SOMETHING. IN YOUR -- IN THAT UNIT, SIR, WHEN YOU COME IN, DID YOU GO IN THROUGH THE GARAGE?
# 98 Q: AND DOES THAT GARAGE DOOR KIND OF SQUEAK?
# 99 A: IT'S NOISY. IT RATTLES AND SHAKES THE UNIT A LITTLE BIT.
# 100 Q: AND WHEN YOU OPEN THE DOOR THAT LEADS INTO THE ACTUAL UNIT ITSELF, IS THERE A NOISE THAT YOUR ALARM GIVES OFF TO INDICATE IT --
# 101 A: YES. I HAVE IT SET SO IT BEEPS SO WHEN THE DOOR OPENS, SOMEONE KNOWS SOMEONE'S COMING.
# 104 Q: SO SOMEONE INSIDE CAN HEAR SOMEONE ENTER?
# 106 Q: AND YOU WENT IN THROUGH THAT PARTICULAR ENTRANCE THAT NIGHT?
# 108 Q: OKAY. THEN WHAT DID YOU DO?
# 109 A: AS I WENT OUT TO MY MAILBOX, WHICH IS IN THE FRONT OF THE CONDO COMPLEX AND AT THAT POINT, I WAS -- NOTICED A DOG BARKING QUITE PROFUSELY.
# 110 Q: WHEN YOU SAY "THE FRONT," WOULD THAT BE ON THE STREET OF BUNDY ITSELF?
# 111 A: YES. IT FACES THE STREET OF BUNDY.
# 112 Q: AND WHERE EXACTLY WERE YOU WHEN YOU SAW THIS DOG?
# 113 A: WELL, I HAD REACHED MY MAILBOX AT THAT POINT, WHICH IS MAYBE 10 FEET FROM THE CURB, AND I SAW A DOG IN THE STREET COMING AT ME BARKING VERY PROFUSELY.
# 114 Q: NOW, AFTER THAT NIGHT, DID YOU SEE THAT DOG ON NEWSCASTS AND TELEVISION?
# 115 A: YES. SUBSEQUENTLY, I DID SEE IT, YES.
# 116 Q: AND DID YOU RECOGNIZE THE DOG YOU SAW ON TELEVISION AS THE ONE YOU HAD SEEN THAT NIGHT BARKING IN THE STREET ON BUNDY?
# 118 MS. CLARK: YOUR HONOR, I HAVE HERE A BOARD. I SHOWED IT TO COUNSEL YESTERDAY. I WOULD ASK THAT IT BE MARKED PEOPLE'S 40.
# 119 THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. PEOPLE'S 40.
# 120 (PEO'S 40 FOR ID = POSTERBOARD/3 PHOTOS) # 121 MS. CLARK: THANK YOU.
# 122 Q: BY MS. CLARK: YOU SEE THE DOG DEPICTED IN THE PHOTOGRAPHS THAT HAVE BEEN MARKED AS PEOPLE'S 40?
# 124 Q: AND DO YOU RECOGNIZE THE DOG THAT IS SHOWN TO YOU THERE?
# 125 A: I WOULD SAY THAT'S THE SAME DOG.
# 126 Q: THE SAME DOG THAT YOU SAW BARKING IN THE STREET ON BUNDY ON THE NIGHT OF JUNE THE 12TH AT APPROXIMATELY 10:45?
# 127 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 128 MR. COCHRAN: OBJECTION, YOUR HONOR. MISSTATES THE TESTIMONY, 1045. HE'S NOT CLEAR WHAT TIME IT IS, AT WHAT POINT HE WENT TO THE MAILBOX.
# 129 THE COURT: APPROXIMATELY. THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID, APPROXIMATELY. OVERRULED. JUST SO THE RECORD IS CLEAR, PEOPLE'S EXHIBIT 40 IS A BOARD THAT APPEARS TO CONTAIN FOUR PHOTOGRAPHS, THREE OF WHICH ARE A DOG AND THE FOURTH APPEARS TO BE A -- WHAT IS IT, COLLAR?
# 130 MS. CLARK: COLLAR. THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.
# 131 Q: BY MS. CLARK: YES, SIR. YOU GOT HOME AT 10:45. DID YOU GO DIRECTLY INTO YOUR APARTMENT AND OUT TO THE STREET TO GET TO YOUR MAIL?
# 133 Q: SO 10:45 OR -47, YOU SAW THE DOG?
# 134 A: I WOULD SAY THAT'S PRETTY ACCURATE.
# 135 Q: AND WHERE IN THE STREET WAS THE DOG WHEN YOU SAW IT?
# 136 A: AT THAT POINT, IT WAS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET JUST RUNNING OR WALKING AIMLESSLY.
# 138 A: BARKING VERY LOUDLY.
# 139 Q: AND WHAT DID IT DO WHEN YOU APPROACHED YOUR MAIL BOX?
# 140 A: IT STARTED TO APPROACH ME, WHICH IT DID SCARE ME. SO I ACTUALLY RETREATED BACK INSIDE MY GATE UNTIL IT MOVED ON.
# 141 Q: WHEN YOU RETREATED BACK INSIDE YOUR GATE, WHAT DID IT DO?
# 142 A: AFTER THAT, A FEW, MAYBE 20 SECONDS OR SO, IT STARTED BACK INTO THE STREET WALKING UP TOWARDS MONTANA.
# 143 Q: WHEN YOU SAW THAT DOG, DID YOU HAPPEN TO SEE ANYBODY ELSE IN THE STREET?
# 144 A: YES. I SAW SOMEBODY WALKING ACROSS THE STREET WITH A DOG ALSO HEADING NORTH.
# 145 Q: WAS IT A COUPLE OF PEOPLE OR WAS IT ONE PERSON?
# 146 A: ONE PERSON. I BELIEVE IT WAS A MAN.
# 151 Q: SO IN WHAT DIRECTION DID YOU SEE THE DOG, THE AKITA GO -- EXCUSE ME -- THE DOG GO?
# 152 A: THE DOG WAS HEADING NORTH TOWARDS MONTANA.
# 153 Q: WHEN YOU WERE OUTSIDE IN FRONT OF YOUR -- IN FRONT OF YOUR APARTMENT UNIT, YOU SAW THE DOG, DID YOU LOOK AROUND TO SEE WHAT WAS CAUSING THE DOG TO BARK?
# 155 Q: CAN YOU DESCRIBE THE LIGHTING IN THAT FRONT AREA ON YOUR STREET?
# 156 A: THE LIGHTING IS NOT -- IT'S NOT GREAT. WE HAVE LIGHTS IN FRONT OF OUR PLACE WHICH ILLUMINATE THE FRONT PART OF OUR UNIT. THERE'S A STREETLIGHT JUST MAYBE 30 FEET TO THE SOUTH, BUT BASICALLY IT'S FAIRLY DARK.
# 157 Q: AND THE APARTMENT OR THE CONDOMINIUM TO YOUR -- THAT'S JUST SOUTH OF YOU, 875 SOUTH BUNDY, WAS IT DARK IN FRONT OF THAT UNIT AS WELL?
# 159 Q: AT SOME POINT AFTER YOU GOT HOME, DO YOU RECALL HEARING THE ACTIVITY OF POLICE ARRIVING TO THE LOCATION?
# 161 Q: DO YOU RECALL APPROXIMATELY WHEN THAT WAS?
# 162 A: I BELIEVE IT WAS ABOUT 1:00 A.M.
# 163 Q: AT 1:00 A.M., WHAT MADE YOU THINK THAT IT WAS THE POLICE THAT WERE THERE?
# 164 A: WELL, I LOOKED OUT OF MY WINDOW.
# 165 Q: YOU SAW THEM THERE.
# 167 Q: DO YOU KNOW IF THAT'S ACTUALLY WHEN THEY ARRIVED OR IS THAT JUST WHEN YOU NOTICED THEM?
# 168 A: NO. SINCE I LIVE IN THE BACK OF THE UNIT, OF HER UNIT, THAT WOULD BE -- THAT'S WHEN I STARTED HEARING A LOT OF NOISE.
# 169 Q: WHEN YOU SAY YOU LIVE IN THE BACK OF THE UNIT, DOES THAT MEAN THAT YOUR UNIT DOES NOT HAVE ACCESS TO BUNDY?
# 171 Q: SO YOUR UNIT FACES THE ALLEY AND THAT'S YOUR EXIT AND ENTRANCE?
# 172 A: WELL, I HAVE TWO ENTRANCES. I CAN COME THROUGH THE FRONT, BUT I ENTER, SINCE I DRIVE IN, FROM THE ALLEY.
# 173 Q: THE FRONT PART OF THAT UNIT THAT FACES BUNDY, IS THAT ALSO PART OF YOUR UNIT?
# 175 Q: THAT BELONGS TO SOMEONE ELSE?
# 177 Q: SO DID YOUR UNIT HAVE ANY WINDOWS THAT FACE OUT ONTO BUNDY?
# 179 Q: HOW MANY DOGS DID YOU SEE BARKING THAT NIGHT?
# 181 Q: THE ONE YOU'VE DESCRIBED?
# 183 Q: AND YOU INDICATED -- I BELIEVE YOU INDICATED THAT YOU HAD HEARD -- WITHDRAW THAT. HAD YOU HEARD DOGS BARKING IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD BEFORE?
# 184 A: ON OCCASION, YES.
# 185 Q: HAD YOU EVER HEARD A DOG BARKING THE WAY YOU HEARD THIS ONE BARKING ON THAT NIGHT?
KEY QUOTE # 187 Q: DID YOU KNOW WHO WAS LIVING NEXT DOOR TO YOU AT 875 SOUTH BUNDY, SIR?
# 189 THE COURT: YOU ASKED THAT QUESTION.
# 192 MS. CLARK: I AM SORRY. I HAVE NOTHING FURTHER. THANK YOU.
# 193 THE COURT: MR. COCHRAN.
# 194 MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU.
# 197 Q: GOOD MORNING, MR. KARPF.
# 198 A: GOOD MORNING, MR. COCHRAN.
# 199 Q: JUST A FEW QUESTIONS IF I MIGHT. SIR, WITH REGARD TO THE TRIP THAT YOU TOOK TO SAN JOSE, YOU RETURNED SUNDAY EVENING AND YOU RECALL THAT YOU RETURNED ABOUT 10:00 O'CLOCK IN THE EVENING?
# 201 Q: AND ON WHAT AIRLINE WERE YOU TRAVELING, DO YOU RECALL?
# 203 Q: AND WAS THE FLIGHT DUE IN AT 10:00 O'CLOCK OR JUST HAPPENED TO GET IN AT 10:00 O'CLOCK?
# 204 A: I THINK IT WAS DUE IN AT ABOUT 9:30.
# 205 Q: SO IT WAS LATE, ABOUT HALF AN HOUR?
# 207 Q: AND HAD YOU CHECKED ANY LUGGAGE?
# 209 Q: AND SO YOU HAD CARRY-ON?
# 211 Q: AND WITH REGARD TO ARRIVING ABOUT 10:00 O'CLOCK, AFTER YOU RETRIEVED YOUR CARRY-ON LUGGAGE, WHERE WERE YOU -- HOW DID YOU GET HOME? DID YOU HAVE YOUR CAR PARKED THERE SOMEWHERE?
# 213 Q: AND WHERE WAS THE CAR PARKED?
# 214 A: IT WAS PARKED RIGHT NEXT TO THE TERMINAL. I THINK IT'S CALLED PARK ONE.
# 215 Q: ALL RIGHT. SO TERMINAL ONE IS WHERE SOUTHWEST IS?
# 217 Q: AND THEN YOU WOULD PARK IN THAT NEW PARKING AREA THERE, PARK ONE?
# 218 A: THAT'S CORRECT. WALKED RIGHT TO IT.
# 219 Q: AND THEN YOU WALKED ACROSS, GOT YOUR CAR; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 220 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 221 Q: AND YOU THEN HEADED HOME TO THE 873 BUNDY ADDRESS; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 223 Q: NOW, DO YOU RECALL SPEAKING WITH TWO OFFICERS, OFFICER R.O. HARO, H-A-R-O, AND J.A. HARPER IN CONNECTION WITH THIS MATTER BACK ON JULY 7, 1994 ABOUT 4:00 O'CLOCK IN THE AFTERNOON?
# 224 A: I DON'T REMEMBER THEIR NAMES, BUT I DID SPEAK TO TWO OFFICERS.
# 225 Q: ALL RIGHT. AND WHERE DID YOU TALK TO THEM, SIR, IF YOU RECALL?
# 226 A: THEY CAME TO MY BUSINESS, PLACE OF BUSINESS.
# 227 Q: AND THAT WAS SOMEWHERE DOWNTOWN L.A.?
# 229 Q: AND YOU TALKED TO THEM ABOUT THE EVENTS AND YOUR INVOLVEMENT IN THOSE EVENTS OF THE NIGHT OF JUNE 12TH, 1994; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 231 Q: AND SPECIFICALLY, DO YOU RECALL TELLING OFFICERS HARO AND HARPER THAT MR. KARPF INDICATED THAT HE ARRIVED HOME FROM LAX AIRPORT (SAN JOSE) AT APPROXIMATELY 2250 TO 2300 HOURS, THAT IS 10:50 TO 11:00 O'CLOCK? DO YOU REMEMBER TELLING THEM THAT?
# 232 A: I MIGHT HAVE SAID IN THAT APPROXIMATE TIME, YES.
# 233 Q: AND THAT WOULD BE FAIRLY ACCURATE; WOULD IT NOT BE?
# 234 A: WITHIN 10 MINUTES EITHER SIDE, YES. MAYBE FIVE MINUTES.
# 235 Q: FIVE OR 10 MINUTES.
# 236 MR. COCHRAN: MAY I APPROACH, YOUR HONOR?
# 237 Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: I WOULD LIKE TO SHOW YOU THE REPORT AND ASK YOU TO READ THIS. AND I'LL ASK YOU READ IT TO YOURSELF FIRST, MR. KARPF. WHY DON'T YOU JUST READ FROM HERE TO THERE FIRST.
# 238 A: (THE WITNESS COMPLIES).
# 239 Q: ALL RIGHT. HAVE YOU NOW READ THAT?
# 241 Q: AND DOES THAT TEND TO REFRESH YOUR RECOLLECTION THAT YOU DID IN FACT TELL THESE OFFICERS THAT YOU HAD --
# 242 MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. THERE'S BEEN NO INDICATION THIS WITNESS NEEDS HIS MEMORY REFRESHED.
# 243 MR. COCHRAN: MAY I FINISH THE QUESTION?
# 244 THE COURT: YOU MAY.
# 245 Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: DOES THE REVIEW OF THE REPORT THAT I JUST PROVIDED TO YOU IN ANY WAY REFRESH YOUR RECOLLECTION THAT YOU TOLD THE OFFICERS THAT YOU ARRIVED HOME FROM LAX AIRPORT AT APPROXIMATELY 10:50 TO 11:00 O'CLOCK P.M.?
# 246 A: I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY 10 -- YOU KNOW, WITHIN FIVE MINUTES EITHER SIDE, YES.
# 247 Q: ALL RIGHT. AND WHEN YOU WERE TALKING TO THE OFFICERS, YOU WERE TRYING TO BE AS ACCURATE AS YOU COULD, WEREN'T YOU?
# 249 Q: AND YOU HAD NO REASON TO NOT TO BE ACCURATE IN TELLING THEM THAT, WOULD YOU?
# 251 Q: AND WHEN YOU WOULD TALK TO THEM, YOU SAW THEM WRITE DOWN WHAT YOU WERE SAYING; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 253 Q: YOU TOLD THEM YOU HAD BEEN TO SAN JOSE AND THEY WROTE THAT DOWN; IS THAT RIGHT?
# 255 Q: ALL RIGHT. NOW, AFTER YOU ARRIVED HOME, YOU DESCRIBED HOW YOU CAME -- YOU COME IN THE REAR, THAT REAR ALLEYWAY THERE THAT PARALLELS BUNDY; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 257 Q: YOU THEN CAME IN THE GARAGE. DID YOU GO INTO THE HOUSE AT ALL BEFORE YOU WENT TO YOUR MAILBOX, IF YOU RECALL?
# 258 A: WELL, I HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE HOUSE TO GET TO THE MAILBOX.
# 259 Q: ALL RIGHT. SO YOU COME IN THE GARAGE, THEN YOU UNLOCK THE DOOR AND I PRESUME THEN YOU GO IN THE HOUSE?
# 261 Q: AND THEN YOU PUT YOUR LUGGAGE DOWN, THAT SORT OF THING?
# 262 A: I WOULD JUST DROP IT ON THE FLOOR.
# 263 Q: DROP IT. AND THEN YOUR FIRST GOAL WAS THEN TO GET OUT AND TRY TO GET YOUR MAIL; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 264 A: THAT'S WHAT I DID.
# 265 Q: OKAY. AND THEN SO YOU GO THROUGH THE HOUSE TOWARD BUNDY TO GO AND TRY TO FIND YOUR MAIL; IS THAT RIGHT?
# 267 Q: AND IT WAS AT THAT POINT -- WOULD YOU SAY THAT WOULD BE WITHIN THREE TO FIVE MINUTES OF YOUR ARRIVAL IN THE GARAGE THAT YOU WENT OUT TO YOUR MAILBOX?
# 268 A: I THINK THREE MINUTES WOULD BE ACCURATE.
# 269 Q: THREE MINUTES? OKAY. SO YOU GOT HOME AT 10:50 OR 11:00 O'CLOCK. SO WITHIN THREE MINUTES OF THAT OR WHATEVER TIME IT WAS, YOU THEN WENT OUT TO YOUR MAILBOX; IS THAT RIGHT?
# 270 A: THAT WOULD BE CORRECT.
# 271 Q: AND AT THAT POINT, THAT'S WHEN YOU SAW THIS DOG THAT YOU BELIEVED IS THE DOG DEPICTED ON PEOPLE'S 40 THERE; IS THAT CORRECT, SIR?
# 272 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 273 Q: AND AT THE TIME YOU SAW THAT DOG, YOU HAD NEVER SEEN THAT DOG BEFORE; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 274 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 275 Q: AT SOME POINT, EVEN THOUGH YOU RETREATED BACK INSIDE YOUR GATE, YOU WERE ABLE TO GET YOUR MAIL AT SOME POINT; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 277 Q: AND DID YOU EVER HAVE OCCASION TO LOOK TO YOUR RIGHT IN THE GENERAL DIRECTION OF 875 SOUTH BUNDY? DID YOU LOOK IN THAT GENERAL DIRECTION AT ALL?
# 278 A: I DON'T THINK I DID, NO.
# 279 Q: ALL RIGHT. SO YOU HAVE NO RECOLLECTION OF -- WELL, YOU DON'T THINK YOU DID ACTUALLY LOOK TO YOUR RIGHT?
# 280 A: IF I DID, I WOULDN'T SEE ANYTHING ANYWAY.
KEY QUOTE # 281 Q: ALL RIGHT. SO FROM YOUR VANTAGE POINT, YOU COULDN'T SEE ANYTHING; IS THAT RIGHT?
# 283 Q: ANSWER OUT LOUD. AND THE DOG WAS OUT IN THE CENTER OF THE STREET; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 284 A: IN THE CENTER, RIGHT.
# 285 Q: NOW, SIR, WITH REGARD TO THIS OTHER INDIVIDUAL THAT YOU SAW, YOU INDICATED I BELIEVE THAT YOU SAW ANOTHER MALE WHO WAS ACROSS THE STREET. THAT WOULD BE THEN ON THE EAST SIDE OF BUNDY; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 286 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 287 Q: AND IN WHICH DIRECTION WAS THIS MALE THAT WAS WALKING THE DOG HEADED?
# 288 A: HE WAS HEADED NORTH.
# 289 Q: SO HE WAS HEADED ON THE EAST SIDE HEADED NORTH?
# 290 A: WHICH WOULD GO TOWARDS MONTANA.
# 291 Q: TOWARDS MONTANA; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 293 Q: WAS THAT SOMEONE THAT YOU KNEW?
# 295 Q: WAS THAT SOMEONE YOU HAD EVER SEEN BEFORE?
# 296 A: IT'S HARD TO SAY. IT WAS DARK, YOU KNOW, THAT SIDE OF THE STREET.
# 297 Q: ALL RIGHT. I UNDERSTAND, SIR. HAVE YOU SEEN THAT PERSON SINCE THAT TIME, THIS MALE?
# 298 A: NOT THAT I NOTICED.
# 299 Q: HAVE YOU SEEN THE DOG IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD SINCE THAT TIME?
# 300 A: I DON'T THINK SO.
# 301 Q: ALL RIGHT. CAN YOU DESCRIBE FOR US THE INDIVIDUAL WHO WAS WALKING THE DOG AS HE PROCEEDED NORTHBOUND ON BUNDY APPROACHING MONTANA ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE STREET?
# 302 A: I REALLY CAN'T DESCRIBE HIM. HE WAS A MALE CAUCASIAN.
KEY QUOTE # 303 Q: MALE CAUCASIAN. YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW TALL HE WAS OR HOW MUCH HE WEIGHED?
# 305 Q: YOU HAVE NO RECOLLECTION HOW HE WAS DRESSED?
# 307 Q: CAN YOU IN ANY WAY DESCRIBE THE DOG AT ALL?
# 309 Q: WAS HIS DOG ON A LEASH?
# 310 A: IT WAS ON A LEASH.
# 311 Q: WITH REGARD TO THE DOG THAT YOU BELIEVED WAS THE DOG DEPICTED IN PEOPLE'S 40 THERE, DID THAT DOG HAVE A LEASH ON THAT NIGHT IF YOU RECALL?
# 312 A: I BELIEVE HE DID.
# 313 Q: YOUR RECOLLECTION IS, HE HAD A LEASH?
# 315 Q: ALL RIGHT. AND AS YOU SAW THE DOG RUNNING IN THE STREET WITH THIS LEASH, THE ONLY OTHER PERSON THAT YOU EVER SAW WAS THIS MAN, MALE CAUCASIAN, ACROSS THE STREET WALKING THE DOG; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 316 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 317 Q: WHEN YOU CAME BACK INSIDE YOUR HOUSE, DID YOU HAVE OCCASION TO GO BACK OUT IN THAT ALLEYWAY AT ALL?
# 319 Q: WHEN YOU DROVE UP -- AND AS I UNDERSTAND --
# 320 MR. COCHRAN: CAN WE HAVE -- MAY I HAVE JUST A SECOND, YOUR HONOR?
# 321 THE COURT: CERTAINLY.
# 322 (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND DEFENSE COUNSEL.) # 323 Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: NOW, YOU CAN WATCH YOUR MONITOR IF YOU --
# 324 THE COURT: PEOPLE'S 38 AGAIN?
# 325 MR. COCHRAN: PEOPLE'S 38 I BELIEVE. IS THAT PEOPLE'S 38?
# 327 MR. COCHRAN: 38. THANK YOU.
# 328 Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: MR. KARPF, SIR, WITH REGARD TO YOUR RETURNING HOME, WOULD I BE CORRECT IN ASSUMING THAT YOU PROCEEDED FROM DOROTHY INTO THIS ALLEYWAY HEADING NORTH TO GO INTO YOUR PARTICULAR RESIDENCE?
# 329 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 330 Q: IS THAT CORRECT? AND AS YOU THEN OF NECESSITY IN PROCEEDING NORTHBOUND, YOU PASSED BY 875; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 332 Q: AND DID YOU SEE ANY VEHICLES OUT THERE WHEN YOU DROVE PAST AT --
# 333 A: NOTHING THAT I RECALL.
# 334 Q: -- 10:50 OR 11:00? YOU DON'T RECALL ANYTHING AT ALL?
# 336 Q: DID YOU SEE ANY OTHER PARTIES IN THAT ALLEY WHEN YOU DROVE IN THERE THAT YOU RECALL AT THIS POINT?
# 338 Q: YOU -- DID YOU FIRST BECOME AWARE OF THE POLICE AFTER ABOUT 1:00 O'CLOCK THAT PARTICULAR MORNING --
# 339 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 340 Q: -- THE MORNING OF THE 13TH? BUT YOU DID NOT TALK TO THE POLICE AT THAT TIME?
# 342 Q: YOU JUST KNEW THEY WERE OUT THERE?
# 344 Q: AND YOU DIDN'T TALK TO THE POLICE ACTUALLY IN CONNECTION WITH THIS CASE UNTIL ABOUT JULY 7TH; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 345 A: I WAS INTERVIEWED ON JULY 7TH.
# 346 Q: AND THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME YOU WERE INTERVIEWED?
# 347 A: WHEN I WALKED OUT FRONT THE NEXT MORNING AND GAVE A -- THEY ASKED ME A COUPLE QUESTIONS.
# 348 Q: DID THEY WRITE THAT DOWN?
# 349 MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. SPECULATION.
# 350 THE COURT: OVERRULED. HE CAN ANSWER.
# 351 Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: YOU WALKED OUT FRONT THE NEXT MORNING, THAT'S JUNE 13?
# 353 Q: AND WHO DID YOU TALK TO, IF YOU KNOW?
# 354 A: I DON'T RECALL THE OFFICER'S NAME.
# 355 Q: ALL RIGHT. WAS THIS OFFICER IN UNIFORM OR WAS THIS OFFICER --
# 356 A: HE WAS IN UNIFORM.
# 357 Q: HE WAS IN UNIFORM? HAVE YOU SEEN THAT OFFICER SINCE THAT TIME?
# 359 Q: CAN YOU IDENTIFY HIM AT ALL?
# 361 Q: HE JUST ASKED A FEW QUESTIONS?
# 362 A: JUST A FEW BASIC QUESTIONS.
# 363 Q: LIKE WHAT KIND OF BASIC QUESTIONS?
# 364 A: WHERE I WAS LAST NIGHT. HE WOULDN'T TELL ME WHAT WAS HAPPENING IN THE CRIME SCENE. SO -- AND THERE WAS NOTHING THAT I EVEN KNEW ABOUT THE CRIME SCENE UNTIL MUCH LATER IN THE DAY.
# 365 Q: ALL RIGHT. YOU JUST HAD A BRIEF CONVERSATION?
# 367 Q: AND THEN YOUR FIRST FORMAL INTERVIEW THEN WAS ON JULY 7TH, 1994?
# 369 Q: WHEN -- HOW CLOSE DID YOU GET TO THE AKITA THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT?
# 370 A: I WOULD SAY HE CAME WITHIN 15 FEET.
# 371 Q: AND THAT'S WHEN YOU KIND OF RETREATED; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 373 Q: ALL RIGHT. WHEN YOU ARRIVED -- WHEN YOU FINALLY GOT INTO THE HOUSE AND UPSTAIRS, I PRESUME IF WE FOLLOW YOUR TRAIL, YOU GOT THE MAIL AND THEN YOU CAME BACK INSIDE; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 374 A: THAT IS CORRECT.
# 375 Q: AND DID YOU AT SOME POINT GO UPSTAIRS TO YOUR BEDROOM AREA?
# 376 A: I DID AROUND 12:00 O'CLOCK.
# 377 Q: ALL RIGHT. YOU DIDN'T GO UP UNTIL 12:00 O'CLOCK?
# 379 Q: HUM. SO WHEN YOU GOT THERE AT 12:00 O'CLOCK -- IN OTHER WORDS, YOU HAD NOT BEEN UP THERE UNTIL 12:00 O'CLOCK FROM THE TIME YOU ARRIVED HOME, IS THAT RIGHT, UPSTAIRS?
# 381 Q: AND WOULD THAT BE THE FIRST TIME THAT YOU SAW YOUR FIANCE', MISS STEIN, AT ABOUT 12:00 O'CLOCK THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT?
# 382 A: ACTUALLY, I PROBABLY WENT UP TO PUT SOMETHING IN, BUT SHE WAS IN BED, SO I DIDN'T WAKE HER UP.
# 383 Q: SHE WAS SLEEPING WHEN YOU WENT UP, IS THAT RIGHT, AS NEAR AS YOU CAN TELL?
# 384 A: AS NEAR AS I CAN TELL, YES.
# 385 Q: SO WHEN YOU WENT UP THERE ABOUT 12:00 O'CLOCK, IS THAT WHEN --
# 386 A: THAT'S WHEN I DECIDED TO GO TO BED.
# 387 Q: AND DID YOU WAKE HER UP AT THAT POINT?
# 388 A: TO BE HONEST, I DON'T REMEMBER IF I WOKE HER. I'M SURE I DID. I HAD BEEN GONE FOR ALL WEEKEND.
# 389 Q: SO YOU THINK YOU PROBABLY WOKE HER UP? ALL RIGHT. THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN ABOUT 12:00 O'CLOCK?
# 391 Q: ALL RIGHT. AND THE POLICE -- YOU BECAME AWARE OF THE POLICE IN THAT ALLEYWAY SOMETIME AROUND AN HOUR AFTER THAT; IS THAT CORRECT?
# 392 A: APPROXIMATELY, YES.
# 393 Q: HAD YOU FALLEN ASLEEP BY THAT TIME?
# 394 A: I THINK I DID, YES.
# 395 Q: SO IT WAS THE NOISE IN THE ALLEY THAT AWAKENED YOU ALSO?
# 397 Q: ALL RIGHT. WITH REGARD TO THE AKITA, DID YOU EVER SEE ANYTHING ON THE PAWS OF THE AKITA AT ALL?
# 399 Q: YOU DIDN'T SEE ANYTHING AT ALL ON THE PAWS OF THE AKITA?
# 401 MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. KARPF.
# 402 LOUIS KARPF: YOU ARE WELCOME.