Detective Phillips.
RON PHILLIPS, called as a witness on behalf of Plaintiff Goldman, was duly sworn and testified as follows:
You do solemnly swear that the testimony you may give in the cause now pending before this court shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
A police officer for the city of Los Angeles, currently assigned as the homicide supervisor at West Los Angeles area.
I'm in charge of the homicide unit. I oversee the cases that are being investigated by people that work for me. I respond to crime scenes. I assign detectives at those crime scenes to handle those crime scenes. I review their reports. I discuss the cases with them. Give them direction if they need to be -- Basically oversee everything that they do.
Let me take you to early morning hours of June 13, 1994, if I might, and ask if you received an early morning phone call?
I made phone calls to individuals that worked the West Los Angeles homicide unit and told them that we had a double homicide at 875 south Bundy. And requested that they respond to West L.A. station and pick up their vehicles and then meet me at 875 south Bundy.
I received the phone call at about 1'o'clock in the morning on June -- on June 13. I immediately made a phone call to three detectives at this time.
It's not being offered for the truth of the matter asserted. He's the -- instructions are or whatever it is go ahead.
I told each one of them that we had a double homicide. I gave them the location, told them that I was -- I was told by Sergeant Rossi that one of the victim's, a female, may or may not be the ex-wife or the former wife of O.J. Simpson.
Did any of the detectives ask if they -- you could get other coverage and if they could not come in.
It's stricken. I don't know what the relevance of all of this is. Let me get down to --
(BY MR. MEDVENE) Did there come a time when you met with any of the detectives at the West Los Angeles homicide?
Yes. I arrived at West Los Angeles about 1:50 in the morning. I met Mark Fuhrman at that station at about 1:55 in the morning.
Yes. I went out and picked up the homicide vehicle that was assigned to us. Put some items into it, flashlights, notebooks, things of that nature; and we drove to 875 south Bundy together.
I arrived. I first noticed Sergeant Dave Rossi was the watch commander at West Los Angeles. I walked up to him, basically asked him what had happened, what had -- what he knew and asked him if he could show me what the first responding officer that knew the most information about this crime scene was.
Sergeant Rossi was on the phone with an individual at the time I walked up to him. He was mentioning the individual's name. He was calling him Commander Bushey. He then handed me the telephone and told me that the commander wished to talk to me.
At the end of your conversation with Commander Bushey, what was your understanding of West L.A. detectives role in this case.
He wanted to know if we had the resources at West Los Angeles to handle homicide and I told the commander that I had just arrived, hadn't done a walk through. I knew nothing.
And he again asked me if we had the resources. I said I don't know. I have not done a walk-through yet. I'll make -- have to make a walk-through and I'll get in touch with you again.
And then he said that it turned out to be the wife or the former wife of O.J. Simpson. He wanted to make sure that I notified Mr. Simpson in person about the death of his exwife or wife. That I did not want the news media to make that notation or have him find out any other way.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) Detective Phillips, if you wouldn't mind, could you -- could you approach what's 205, victims bodies in relation to each other at the crime scene and tell us, on your walk-through, what you observed?
Well, the original walk-through that I took with Officer Riske went through this area here, the foliage in the bushes, not on the walkway itself, and walked up to this area in there where there was a call box. That's as close as we approached either one of the bodies from that location.
When we walked up, Sergeant or Officer Riski started pointing out things. He originally pointed out the victim Nicole Brown. He shined his flashlight over to the corner. He showed us victim Ron Goldman. He then pointed out this envelope. He pointed out the glove that was underneath this bush and also a knit cap.
He then told me that behind Mr. Goldman there was a set of keys laying in this area back in here and also a pager.
It -- well, there was a much more light on at the front door of the residence, which is up on top of these stairs and off to your left.
This area down in here was relatively still dark, and it was early in the morning, so we used our flashlights. I had a flashlight and Officer Riske had one and so did Detective Fuhrman.
Well, I have a mag light. A mag light, which I don't remember the candle power of it which is bright. Riske had him -- had the same kind and Mark Fuhrman had a smaller mag light.
With the aid of the flashlight, we could see everything that was being pointed out to us by Officer Riske very clearly.
Where was Officer Fuhrman when Officer Riske was pointing out to you whatever he was pointing out?
He was standing behind me. We approached this location where the call box was there in single file with Officer Riske leading. I was second and officer -- Detective Fuhrman was behind me. That's basically the way we stood except for moving around a little bit to look around each other.
I just saw one glove, sir. That -- the glove underneath this bush right in this area.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) Now, after the observations that you made and Officer Riske leading you through, where did you then go or what did you then do?
I walked out the same way that I had walked in, back out onto the grass walkway just off the street.
Riske had pointed out several portions where there was blood that they had detected where a dog had run up and down a sidewalk. He pointed that out to us. We were not walking on the sidewalk.
I then walked southbound on Bundy to a street called Dorothy and made a right turn on Dorothy, which would take me westbound to the rear of the condominium and walk northbound, up through an alley to the rear of that residence.
When I arrived at the back, Officer Riske pointed out a black jeep that was parked in the driveway. He pointed out that the right passenger door was somewhat ajar like it hadn't closed all the way.
He then showed me, I believe it was a dime and a penny that was laying in the driveway. Showed me a spot of -- couple spots of blood. And then Sergeant Rossi took me to a rear gate and pointed out the gate. We went inside the gate. We started to walk down the walkway to explain to me how some foot prints had faded out and hadn't come back out that far.
We didn't walk very far. We walked a short ways and I said is there a better way to get into this location without walking through here? And he said, yeah. And we went back out the gate and we met Fuhrman and Riske, who were standing outside the gate, still looking at the driveway.
He then took us to the garage door which was open. There was a white Ferrari in the garage. We walked around that vehicle and entered the residence, went through the garage door.
As we walked in the back door, Officer Riske pointed out an ice cream cup that was sitting on a banister and pointed out a spoon that had fallen on the other side of the banister that was on a step leading down a few steps that went into another room.
We walked up the steps into the kitchen area, through the kitchen area, into the dining room area; the dinning room area into the living room area and out the front door that was open.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) So you're to the point, I think, Detective Phillips, where you went out the front door?
Officer Riske was leading. I was following him and Detective Fuhrman was behind me. I walked out the front door into a landing area which is just before the steps.
Yes, there's a landing area up here and then these steps lead down to the walkway. We stayed on the landing area and never walked down the steps.
From that location with the aid of the flashlights, Detective or Officer Riske again pointed out certain items. You could see better from that location up there above.
The only gloves I ever saw that day, sir, at the Bundy location was that glove I pointed out previously.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) Again, when these observations were being made up at the landing, where was Officer Riske? Where were you? Where was Detective Fuhrman?
We were all very closely knit together, standing there and listening to Officer Riske tell us basically what he had seen and pointing out items to us.
He then said that there was footprints. Officer Riske then said there were footprints that led westbound on the north side of the condominium and also some blood drops that he had observed and wanted to show us those. So we walked west.
I place before you what's been marked 2059. It's titled 875 south Bundy walkway. And could you pick me up, and in terms of where you were in your description of, what you then did with Officer Riske and with Detective Fuhrman?
Well, this area up in here is the landing I was referring to, looking down these steps to where Ms. Simpson lay, here, and Mr. Goldman was over here.
We then walked back this walkway here, leading westbound on the north side of the condominium all the way back to this gate here. And as we walked along, the footprints faded out. He showed us the faded footprints as they faded out and also a few drops of blood that I had noticed.
Now, did you, at that time or earlier on the first trip, observe anything on the back gate.
Objection, Your Honor. Compound and leading or he's already -- he's already asked the question --
I -- two droplets of blood were pointed out to me. Than on the bottom rung on the inside of the gate, which would be the east side of the gate, a smudge type of appearance was pointed out to me. Than on the top rung of the gates, also on the east side of the gate, there was some blood that was pointed out to me on the latch of the gate.
At that time, we walked back out to the alley and Detective or Officer Riske then took us back in through the house and showed us the basic lay out of the house. And took us in all the rooms. Showed us different items that were inside the house.
I then exited the house with Officer Riske and Detective Fuhrman, walked into the alley, which is outside this gate. Up here. There's an alley behind there.
By this gate, it's the top most picture in what I had identified as 2059, it's 2057; the exhibit.
Is that the gate in the rear picture?
As a result of those conversations, was a decision made as to whether or not robbery/homicide would become involved in the investigation?
Lieutenant Frank Spangler, my commanding officer, informed me that robbery homicide division -- he had made the decision that robbery homicide division would handle this case. And for me to get in touch with the robbery homicide commander and make the necessary notification, which I did.
He asked me to get in touch with commanding officer of robbery homicide division, which I did.
Well, the -- have the -- would you like to have it read?
(The reporter read back requested
portion as follows:)
"A. Lieutenant Frank Spangler, my commanding officer, informed me that robbery homicide division -- he had made the decision that robbery homicide division would handle this case. And for me to get in touch with the robbery homicide commander and make the necessary notification, which I did."
(BY MR. MEDVENE) At the time of the conversations with Lieutenant Frank Spangler, did you also have a conversation with Sergeant Rossi with respect to robbery homicide division?
As a result of your speaking with Lieutenant Spangler and Sergeant Rossi, did you make any phone calls?
The first phone call I made was to detective, head quarters division which is our 24-hour command post, asked ask them for the home phone number of Captain William Gartland who is a commanding officer of robbery/homicide division.
Told him where I was. Told him what I had been shown, what we had at that location. Who may or may not be involved. And that it was determined that it would be a high profile case and that they were asking that his unit, his division take over the investigation.
Told me to get in touch with Lieutenant John Rodgers who was the on-call Lieutenant to talk to him about having one of his is teams that was on call that evening respond at a location.
Told him the same thing I had told Captain Gartland and told him that I talked to Captain Gartland and Captain Gartland had informed me to call him to tell him that his officer would take over the investigation of this homicide, double homicide.
I then walked into the residence where Mark Fuhrman and Brad Roberts were at inside the condominium and informed them that the case was no longer our responsibilities. That the decision had been made to be -- robbery/homicide would now handle this investigation. And any investigation that they were doing was to cease at that time. And we were to leave the residence.
Fuhrman at this time was taking notes. Writing some notes down. He said give me one more minute to write another note down here that I've got in my head and -- which he did.
And the three of us then left the residence and he handed me his notes and told me that -- I told him to give me his notes. I would give them to on one of the robbery/homicide detectives.
Walked southbound out of the alley to Dorothy and eastbound on Dorothy out to the intersection of Bundy and Dorothy where all the other police officers were standing.
Basically it had already been told to everybody that robbery/homicide was now handling this case. That everybody was in a stand down position. That just to maintain the security of the crime scene and everybody was to stay in their positions. And that robbery/homicide was sending some other detectives to do this investigation.
1:30, ladies and gentlemen. Don't talk about the case. Don't form or express any opinion.
You may proceed.
RON PHILLIPS, previously called as a witness was sworn and testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION (CONTINUED)
You said at the break that you're all standing outside waiting for robbery/homicide to arrive. Why didn't you instruct the other detectives and -- To just leave?
Well, the double homicide that occurred in West Los Angeles division, we didn't know if robbery/homicide would need assistance or even wanted our assistance.
Once they arrived, I instructed them to stay. I would talk to robbery/homicide. If they wanted to us to leave, we would leave the location. If they wanted us to stay and assist them, that's what we would do.
Approximately what time was it when you were all together outside waiting for the robbery/homicide people to come?
Well, possibly 2:45, 2:50, somewhere in that vicinity. I think I made the phone call to DHQ about 2:39, 2:39 in the morning.
What transpired between 2:45, 2:50, whenever it was, when you're all together outside and when Detective Vannatter arrived?
Well, the crime scene was basically secured. The officers all on stationary post were left in those positions. The command staff of west L.A was this the street at Dorothy and Bundy where I was; and most of the officers that worked for me. I think at one time I sent Detective Brad Roberts and Detective Noland back to West L.A. station to conduct an interview of one individual.
And then we waited at that location until robbery/homicide showed up. And I also directed a photographer to cover all outside photographs of the Bundy crime scene, but not the crime scene itself.
Now, when detective -- strike that.
Was Detective Fuhrman, to your knowledge, during this period of time from 2:45, 2:50 to the time Detective Vannatter arrived to 4:05 --
I introduced myself to him. I'd never met him before. Explained to him who I was, that I was the coordinator for West L.A. homicide and that I would take him on a walk-through of the crime scene.
We walked -- I walked with Detective Vannatter back to Bundy and Dorothy and was at the police cars in the intersection awaiting his partner.
Detective Vannatter, Detective Lange had a short conversation. Then Detective Vannatter introduced Detective Lange to me and told him that I would take him through a walk-through, which I did.
And on the walk-through of both Detective Vannatter and Lange, did you point out particular evidence that you observed?
Now after the walk-through with Detective Lange, did there come a time when you told either detective anything about your instructions from Commander Bushey?
I had first mentioned to Detective Vannatter when we were waiting for Detective Lange that I'd been instructed to do that.
Did the fact Mr. Simpson was a celebrity, in your opinion, have anything to do with your going over to give him a personal notification?
Objection. Irrelevant. Lack of foundation. Calls for speculation. Calls for hearsay.
Commander Bushey had instructed me to do that because of Mr. Simpson's stature in the neighborhood and the community. He was a well-known individual and he felt it would be insensitive for him to find out about this incident from the newspaper or by having someone call his house. So he wanted me to make the notification to him in person.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) Strike what Commander Bushey felt.
In your opinion of having worked West L.A. division, was the personal notification to be given to Mr. Simpson different than others who might not have a celebrity status would ordinarily receive?
In the form that it is stated, I don't see -- I don't understand that question at all. What's his experience in west L.A. got to do with that?
Your Honor, if he's going -- I ask that we approach the side bar if he's going to.
It was not unusual and that I made a notification. It was unusual that I had been directed to do so by a commanding officer of a commander rank to do that. I'd never had a commander tell me to do this before.
And did that, in your judgment, from your understanding of how west L.A. Department works, have anything to do with Mr. Simpson's status.
Yes. The four of us, Vannatter, Lange Fuhrman and I were all standing in the middle of Bundy avenue in front of the crime scene. And to -- and Phil Vannatter, Lange were talking and I said --
Overruled. You asked me to strike it, I struck his answer. So that part no longer is in evidence.
You ruled it was irrelevant. I thought that was the basis of the prior objection.
I don't want to conduct your examination, counsel but you know, let's get on with it and ask the question you want to ask. What is it you want to ask him?
I want to ask him, Your Honor, what was his understanding of why he was going to Rockingham.
What difference does it make what his understanding was. Why don't you ask him why they went to Rockingham. Why did you go to Rockingham?
Went to Rockingham to notify Mr. Simpson about the death of his ex-wife.
How long did you expect to be at Rockingham when -- Strike that.
At the time you left Bundy, what functions did you intend to perform at Rockingham?
Did you intend to assist Mr. Simpson in retrieving his children from west L.A police department?
(BY MR. MEDVENE) When you went -- Strike that.
Can you tell us what, if anything, your going to Rockingham had to do with assisting in Simpson in getting his children from West L.A. police station?
(BY MR. MEDVENE) When you went to Rockingham, did you go for any purpose other than to notify Mr. Simpson of the death of his former wife?
Mr. Simpson's children were at West Los Angeles station. I was going to inform him of the death and see if I couldn't be of any assistance to him in taking him back to west L.A. station to pick up his children and take him back to Rockingham and to do whatever I could do to not let him go by the Bundy location.
And while you were doing that, what was your understanding of what Detectives Lange and -- Lange and Vannatter going to do?
(BY MR. MEDVENE) Approximately what time did you -- strike that.
Who was left in charge of the Bundy crime scene at the time you and Detective Fuhrman and Detectives Lange and Vannatter left Bundy for Rockingham?
Lieutenants John Rodgers who is a Lieutenant in charge of robbery/homicide who is Vannatter and Lange's supervisor.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) And how long, if you know, was it anticipated that Detectives Lange and Vannatter would be at Rockingham before returning to Bundy?
They wanted to talk to Mr. Simpson. They said they wanted to talk to Mr. Simpson, introduce themselves to him and them a little bit about maybe what Nicole had done the night before or anything about her activities before they started their investigation.
Did you make, did you or the other detectives make any attempt from outside the Rockingham location to reach Mr. Simpson?
I rang the gate buzzer on the Ashford side of the property. I rang it several times. I think it's Ashton. And some of the other detectives also rang that buzzer and we received no answer.
Yes. I noticed a Westec patrol sign on the property so I called the watch commander at West L.A. station and had them contact Westec and see if they couldn't find out information about whether or not -- whether or not the people were out of town. Where somebody was on the property. Basically if we had another emergency phone number. If someone was not there, we could call somebody else.
Its evening that this was taken place. I was using my own personal cell phone and this it is my phone bill for those two days, June 12 and June 13. My own personal phone bill.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) And does that phone bill indicate what time you made the phone call to Mr. Simpson's residence from outside his residence on June 13?
Now, what was your understanding as of that time. Oh, strike that. I'm sorry. When you made that phone call, did you receive any response?
No. I did. Well, there was an answering machine with a prerecorded message from Mr. `O.J. Simpson asking us to leave a message.
As of that time, what was your understanding whether or not anyone was to be in the home at this time, 5:30 in the morning.
Westec had no knowledge that anybody had been or had left that residence for any long period of time. There was no notification of any vacation schedules or anything like that.
Another Westec officer informed us that the property, Mr. Simpson estate, lived a 24-hour maid that should be on the property.
(BY MS. MEDVENE) Now, at that point in time, did you have any concern for the safety of who ever maid in -- be in the house?
It was a decision made by Vannatter and Lange to go over the wall and to try to raise somebody on the premise inside -- Or inside the gate.
They were concerned that someone's safety, about something happening at that residence because of other things we had found outside that location.
Detective Phillips, we've put on the board what's been marked 116. And if you would be kind, could you go over to it and illustrate for the jury, when you came in the fence, where you went?
When I drove up -- drove on up on Rockingham avenue, made a right turn over to Ashford. Then I parked my vehicle right around this area here. Detective Lange and Vannatter parked their vehicle behind mine.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) One second. When you say around this area here, a few inches on that chart, left of where it says, "Ashford street or the pathway?"
No. This is the driveway that goes into the residence. We were west of this driveway parked on the curb.
This is the intercom that I approached and pushed the button on and received no answer. And then some of the other detectives also pushed that button and received no answer.
Well, then I stood out in the street making my phone call to Sergeant Rossi. And in a short time later, a Westec unit traveling southbound on Rockingham approached this intersection and I walked up to him and he identified himself and asked him if he was the unit that had responded to our call. He informed me that he was not.
I then obtained the phone number from the house from the Westec officer here. Went back over here to the street, made the phone call to the house. I could hear the phone ringing inside the house and then the answering machine picked up.
A Westec Sergeant then arrived northbound on Rockingham and parked in this area here. Detective Fuhrman, and I think Vannatter at different times, talked to that Westec officer. I did not.
We then stood in this area here. I was on my cell phone. And Detective Vannatter and Detective Lange informed me that they had made the decision that they were going to go over the fence and onto the property.
I said "Fine."
And at this point, right here is where Mark Fuhrman jumped the fence, came back over here, and released some type of a pin mechanism on the hydraulic gate and opened it up and allowed the other three of us to go inside.
I walked up to the front entrance of the house, which was right here, rang the doorbell.
Nobody answered.
I believe another officer may have rang the doorbell, and nobody answered.
I then walked back out onto the driveway, along with the other three detectives. And we walked around this walkway which leads back around the back of the house into the pool area, and walked up to a French-door area, right here at the back of the residence.
And I believe it was Detective Phil Vannatter that knocked on these doors, trying to arouse someone.
Were you able to find someone that let you into the house, to try to see if there was someone there?
And when you say "eventually" you did, who assisted you in gaining entrance to the house to see if Mr. Simpson was there?
Arnelle Simpson, Mr. Simpson's daughter, who was living in this bungalow right back here, we woke her up, and she allowed entrance to the house, allowed us to go into the house.
Now, prior to her allowing you to go into the house, had anyone knocked on a door that turned out to be Mr. Kato Kaelin's room?
Yes. I knocked on the door at Kato Kaelin's room here first, received no answer. There was a Venetian blind on the door that him went three-quarters of the way down, so I bent down and peeked in, and I saw an arm laying on what was a bed or a couch or something. And I got up and told the other detectives, "There's somebody in there. All I can see is an arm."
And immediately after that, the door was opened up by Mr. Kaelin.
KEY QUOTEAnd did you then proceed with Detectives Lange and Vannatter to what turned out to be Ms. Simpson's room and to the house when she opened the door?
Now, when Ms. Simpson went into the main house to try to find Mr. Simpson, did you check to see if the maid was safe, or the housekeeper was safe?
There was no one in that room; the bed was completely made, and the room was all fixed up. Apparently, nobody was in that room.
I called the desk, asked for Mr. O.J. Simpson's room.
They rang a number, and a male answered the phone. And I asked him if he was O.J. Simpson. And he said yes.
And I told him I was Detective Phillips from the Los Angeles Police Department, and that I had some bad news.
I told him that his ex-wife, Nicole, had been killed.
And he immediately said, "Oh, my God! Nicole is killed!" He said, "Oh, my God! Nicole is dead!" He kept repeating himself. And he became very upset.
KEY QUOTE(BY MR. MEDVENE) How many death notifications have you given, Detective Fuhrman, over its last 30 years?
I'm sorry.
How many death notifications have you given, Detective Phillips, over the last 30 years?
In your experience, do people who receive such a notification ordinarily ask how their loved one died?
There's initial shock when I tell them. Then they always want to ask questions about how, why, when, where, am I sure, how do I know.
KEY QUOTE(BY MR. MEDVENE) Now, after the conversation with -- strike that.
Do you recall anything else Mr. Simpson said in the phone call?
Well, I tried to get him to calm down and listen to me.
He eventually calmed down, and I told him that we had his children at West Los Angeles Police Station.
And he immediately said, "What do you have my children at the police station for?"
I told him we had no place to take them; they were in our custody.
And he said, "I'm taking the first flight out of Chicago. I'm coming back to LA. Is my daughter still there, Arnelle?" I said "Yes."
He said, "I want to talk to her."
So I handed the phone to Arnelle.
After I got off the phone with Mr. Simpson, Tom Lange talked to Arnelle Simpson, and I walked into a breakfast nook area of Rockingham, where the doors were open. It's a doorway that I had seen Mark Fuhrman walk out of. And then I was standing around those doors, and he came back to me, walked back into my sight.
He said that he wanted to show me something, that he had found something, and would I go with him.
Placed on the board is what's been marked 145. And I ask you if you'd mind approaching the board, and with the use of the board and the pictures on it, describe for the ladies and gentlemen of the jury and the Court where you and Detective Fuhrman went.
These are the doors I'm referring to. The kitchen is right in this area, and then is like -- I call it a breakfast nook area. I don't know what it really is.
These are the doors that Mark Fuhrman had walked out of and walked back into and I was standing at.
I followed Mark out into the driveway around the garage and walked down this pathway, all the way back to where there was an air conditioner, which is depicted in this picture here.
When you say "this picture here," that's the picture furthest to the left, looking out at that Exhibit 147.
Would you describe that for us?
We're also -- for everyone, he's putting the picture up on the TV monitor.
Which one did you want me to use?
Maybe the TV monitor would be easier.
Yes.
And he walked me back to this air conditioner that sticks out of the wall, and stopped right in this area, and pointed to what appeared to me to be some type have a brown glove.
KEY QUOTEWould you go to 148, which is the second picture on the chart.
And again, that's up on the monitor, if that's helpful for you.
This right here is the -- which is in this picture, also. It's a glove that was lying on the sidewalk in the area of the air conditioner.
At a later time, do you have any knowledge of whether or not an evidence card was put out by the glove, or put near the glove?
All right.
After you had observed the glove and Mr. Fuhrman pointed it out, how close did you get to it?
After looking at it, I told him, I said, "Let's go back to the house and let Vannatter and Lange know about this."
Which we did; we returned back to the house.
And do you know if Detective Fuhrman showed Detective Lange and or Vannatter what he had previously shown you?
Now, after each of you was shown the glove in the area where the glove was found, what occurred?
There was a short conversation between Vannatter and Lange and Fuhrman, and they directed -- Vannatter and Lange directed Mark and I to go back to the Bundy location, to take a look at the other glove at the Bundy location, to see if it was a match, because we had a right-hand glove at this location, and we wanted to see if we had a right or left-hand glove at the other location.
We exited our car. I walked up to Lieutenant Spangler with my supervisor and Lieutenant Rodgers from robbery/homicide, to tell them what happened at Rockingham.
Mark said he was going to go over and take a look at the other glove.
And I said, "Take a photographer with you, and make sure you photograph it."
And, at which time he went over and got Mr. Rokahr, the photographer, and they walked back up to the original crime scene, where Nicole and Ron Goldman were at.
That's a photograph of Mark Fuhrman's hand pointing to the glove that was at the Bundy location.
Mr. Medvene, you're referring to the board constantly, and you have a board up there. And you're also referring to the television. The record is not going to be very clear.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) We were just looking at Exhibit 40 on the TV monitor.
Would you please put up Exhibit 92 on the TV monitor.
Tell us what's depicted in Exhibit 92.
This gentleman here is Detective Mark Fuhrman. He's pointing to the glove that was found at the Bundy location in that area.
Detective Fuhrman walked back to me and told me that he thought it was a match, that it was the same type of glove, it appeared to be the same, and it was a left glove, and that he was going to take the photographer and go back to Rockingham.
Objection. Move to strike as nonresponsive. He asked what Fuhrman did. Calls for hearsay.
(BY MR. MEDVENE) Did Detective Fuhrman, shortly thereafter, to your knowledge, leave Bundy?
Now, how do you remember that the picture was taken at the approximate time that you said it was?
Because that's the time we returned from Rockingham. We returned back to Rockingham about 6:30 in the morning. And within a minute of that time, Mark got a photographer headed back up to have the photograph taken.
I may have let someone use it to make a phone call if an officer was going to be late or something like that, wanted to call home, or... I never lent it to someone to take and keep, only to use.
Okay. I just have one last area.
I place before you, 126.
Unfortunately, it won't work too well on the TV screen.
Could you describe what Exhibit 126 is?
Yes. Detective Vannatter and Detective Lange had called me up at West Los Angeles Station, I believe, the day after, on June 14, and asked that I get in contact with every police officer that was at the crime scene at Bundy and have them come and see me and in the homicide unit and bring the shoes that they had worn at the homicide scene.
And I was to take photographs of the soles and heels of each officer's shoes, which I did. And each picture has the officer's name that goes along with those shoes.
Your Honor, I move to strike as irrelevant. I didn't get a chance to see that particular exhibit just now. And I think, based on the Court's prior order, that is irrelevant.
Exhibits 115, 116, 117, 145, 147, and 148, I believe, are stipulated to both foundation and admissibility. And we would move in 126.
126 are the photographs the witness just testified about, Your Honor, of the SHOES that various officers were wearing at the scene.
Well, that's an officer's name on each Polaroid photograph. And there's the bottom of a shoe, showing the heel and the sole of the shoe.
And they were all taken on the table -- this is a table in the interview room at West L.A. station. Each officer turned around and put his foot up on the table, and I took a Polaroid photograph of the left and the right shoe.
I told him that his ex-wife, Nicole, had been killed. And he immediately said, 'Oh, my God! Nicole is killed!' He said, 'Oh, my God! Nicole is dead!' He kept repeating himself. And he became very upset.
There's initial shock when I tell them. Then they always want to ask questions about how, why, when, where, am I sure, how do I know.
And he walked me back to this air conditioner that sticks out of the wall, and stopped right in this area, and pointed to what appeared to me to be some type of a brown glove.
I knocked on the door at Kato Kaelin's room here first, received no answer. There was a Venetian blind on the door that went three-quarters of the way down, so I bent down and peeked in, and I saw an arm laying on what was a bed or a couch or something.