Direct examination of Steven Schwab

📄 Direct examination of Steven Schwab — Friday, October 25, 1996

Address:

C:\DEPT103\CIVIL\1996\OCT\25\DIRECT-EXAMINATION-OF-STEVEN-S.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 3 of 57

◀ Witness scheduling and jury instructions Direct examination of Sukru Bozdepe ▶

Witness: Steven Schwab
Examiner: Daniel Petrocelli
Called by: Plaintiff • Date: Friday, October 25, 1996 • Utterances: 141

Steven Schwab, a television industry worker who lived near the Bundy crime scene, testified about finding Nicole Brown Simpson's Akita dog loose and bloodied at the corner of Dorothy and Bundy at approximately 10:55 p.m. on June 12, 1994. He described blood on the dog's paws and chest, walked it home, and eventually handed it to his neighbor Sukru Boztepe around 11:50 p.m. after animal control declined to retrieve it.

# 1 MR. PETROCELLI:

Thank you, Your Honor. We call Steven Schwab. STEVEN SCHWAB, called as a witness on behalf of Plaintiff Goldman, was duly sworn and testified as follows:

# 2 THE CLERK:

You do solemnly swear that the testimony you may give in the cause now pending before this court shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?

# 3 STEVEN SCHWAB:

I do.

# 4 THE CLERK:

Please, state and spell both your first and your last names for the record.

# 5 STEVEN SCHWAB:

My name is Steven Schwab, S-T-E-V-E-N, S-C-H-W-A-B.

# 6 THE CLERK:

Thank you. DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. PETROCELLI:

# 7 Q:

Good afternoon, Mr. Schwab.

# 8 A:

Good afternoon.

# 9 Q:

I'm going to give you this pointer; it will make it easier on you. Where do you live?

# 10 A:

I live on Montana Avenue, between Westgate and Bundy, approximately there.

# 11 (Indicating to map of Bundy area.)

# 12 Q:

This is Westgate. I'm pointing to this street?

# 13 A:

Yes, this would be Westgate.

# 14 Q:

You point to the street east of Bundy. We're referring to east of Bundy. We're referring to Exhibit 18, for the record. Did you live there on June 12, 1994?

# 15 A:

Yes, I did.

# 16 Q:

Did you have pets on June 12, 1994?

# 17 A:

Yes. I own two pets, a dog and a cat.

# 18 Q:

And did you take your dog for a walk in the evening?

# 19 A:

Yes, I did.

# 20 Q:

What was your routine, let's say, for a weekday?

# 21 A:

During the week, I used to walk my dog between 11:00 and 11:30 at night.

# 22 Q:

On the weekends. Excuse me.

# 23 A:

Weekends were a little different. On the weekends, I tended to walk -- I walked my dog between 10:30 and 11:00.

# 24 Q:

On June 12, 1994 -- that was a Sunday, right?

# 25 A:

That was a Sunday night, yes.

# 26 Q:

What time did you leave to walk your dog?

# 27 A:

That night, I left just after 10:30.

# 28 Q:

How do you know that?

# 29 A:

Well, my routine was, on Sunday nights, at that time, was to watch the Dick Van Dyke Show from 10:00 to 10:30, and then walk my dog from 10:30 until 11:00, so I would be home by 11 o'clock to watch the Mary Tyler Moore Show.

# 30 Q:

Are you in the entertainment business?

# 31 A:

Yes; I work in television.

# 32 Q:

Okay. So you left on June 12, in the evening, at 10:30?

# 33 A:

Yes, that's right.

# 34 Q:

What is the route that you took on your dog walk? Do you want to point it on out on Exhibit 18 and describe what you're doing, sir?

# 35 A:

Well, my routine was to leave my apartment on Montana, walk down Montana to the corner of Montana and Bundy, then cross Bundy and continue down until I got to this street, which is Gretna Green. I would then turn left and walk down Gretna Green one block, until I got to Gorham. Then I walked up one block along Gorham 'till I got to this street here, which is Amherst. I turned left at Amherst and continued one block until I got to Dorothy; then I would turn left again, walk down Dorothy, past Gretna Green. Then I would get to the corner of Dorothy and Bundy, and then I would continue along Bundy, and then turn right and walk back to my home on Montana.

# 36 Q:

Okay. Now, when you used to get to the corner of Dorothy and Bundy, in your typical routine, what side of the street would you walk north on Bundy, on the west side or the east side?

# 37 A:

When I was walking on Bundy, I tended to walk on the east side of the street along Bundy.

# 38 Q:

And this little icon here represents 875 South Bundy --

# 39 A:

Uh-huh.

# 40 Q:

-- the home of Nicole Brown Simpson at that time. Why did you walk across the street?

# 41 A:

Well, that side of Bundy, the east side of Bundy is much better lit along the sidewalk. The west side is much darker.

# 42 Q:

And typically, how long would it take, based on your normal routine, when you left your house, to get to the corner of Dorothy and Bundy?

# 43 A:

That would take me approximately 20 minutes or so.

# 44 Q:

Okay. Now, on this evening, when you left at 10:30 p.m., as you approach the corner of Dorothy and Bundy, what happened?

# 45 A:

As I approached the corner of Dorothy and Bundy, I saw that there was a large white dog at the corner, barking at the building on the corner.

# 46 Q:

Can you point to where you saw the dog?

# 47 A:

Yes. I saw the dog here at the corner, as I was walking between this alley and Bundy.

# 48 Q:

You were on the north side of the street here?

# 49 A:

At this time, I was on the north side of the street, yeah.

# 50 Q:

And you saw the dog on this northwest corner right here?

# 51 A:

That's correct.

# 52 Q:

And the dog was on the sidewalk?

# 53 A:

The dog was on the sidewalk. There's a corner building here with a path that leads to the door. The dog was looking down that path and barking at the building.

# 54 Q:

A door to a building?

# 55 A:

To a house, a house.

# 56 MR. PETROCELLI:

And, Steve, why don't you put up the next exhibit. I think it's 28.

# 57 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Do you recognize the dog in Exhibit 28?

# 58 A:

Yes.

# 59 Q:

Is that the dog that you saw on the evening of June 12, 1994, at the corner of Dorothy and Bundy?

# 60 A:

Yes, it is.

# 61 Q:

We'll leave that up for a second. Approximately what time was it when you saw the dog at the corner of Dorothy and Bundy?

# 62 A:

That would have been approximately 10:55.

# 63 Q:

Okay.

# 64 A:

Yeah.

# 65 Q:

And what happened when you saw the dog?

# 66 A:

Well, I approached the dog. I was surprised to see a dog loose on the street without an owner. There was no one else around at that time. And I slowly approached the dog and allowed the dog to smell me. And I patted its head to kind of -- to get its confidence. And I noticed that it was wearing a collar. So I touched the collar and turned it around, to try to find if there was a tag that would say where the dog was from, but there was no tag. It was just the collar.

# 67 Q:

Did the dog have a leash?

# 68 A:

There was no leash on the dog.

# 69 Q:

Did you notice anything unusual about the dog?

# 70 A:

As I looked down at the dog, I noticed -- first thing I noticed was that there was a drip of blood on one of the back legs of the dog, and I bent down further to examine it. I saw that there was blood on the paws of the dog, and that the underside and chest of the dog was very dirty. It was -- there was mud or blood on the chest of the dog.

# 71 Q:

Did the blood appear -- the drip of blood that you described, did that appear moist or dry?

# 72 A:

Yes, it appeared moist. It was red and shiny.

KEY QUOTE

# 73 Q:

Did the dog have a leash?

# 74 A:

There was no leash on the dog, no.

# 75 Q:

What happened next? Well, before I get there, you said the dog was barking?

# 76 A:

Yes.

# 77 Q:

In what direction?

# 78 A:

The dog was barking towards the corner house.

# 79 Q:

Okay.

# 80 A:

Towards the door of the house.

# 81 Q:

What kind of barking was it?

# 82 A:

A loud barking, as if to get -- try to get someone's attention, maybe to wake someone up within the house.

# 83 Q:

Okay. Now, after you saw the dog with the blood on him, what did you do?

# 84 A:

Well, I looked around to see if there was anyone in the area, but there wasn't. So at that point, I crossed the street to the other side of Bundy, to see what the dog would do, if it would head off in one direction or another, perhaps lead me back to where it had come from. But the dog didn't do that; the dog stayed with me, followed myself and my dog across the street, to the other side of Bundy.

# 85 Q:

Okay. So with the pointer -- you're saying -- I'll try to trace the route here -- and you cross the street, onto this side of the street, the east side, right?

# 86 A:

Yes, that's correct.

# 87 Q:

Where you thought it was better lit?

# 88 A:

That's my general route home because it's better lit on that side of the street.

# 89 Q:

Than on the other side?

# 90 A:

Yeah.

# 91 Q:

And you started walking north on Bundy?

# 92 A:

Yes.

# 93 Q:

And -- with your dog?

# 94 A:

With my dog.

# 95 Q:

And what was the Akita doing?

# 96 A:

The Akita was doing an interesting thing. It was continuing this pattern of barking at the houses. As I walked along the street, as we passed the path to each house, it would look up the path and bark at the house. But once I got a few steps beyond, it would stop and catch up with myself and my dog.

KEY QUOTE

# 97 Q:

Okay. And then you continued on home?

# 98 A:

I continued on towards home, yes.

# 99 Q:

And what time did you get home?

# 100 A:

I got home at approximately 11:05. The TV was still on when I got home, and the Mary Tyler Moore Show was on. And it was early -- and it was early in the episode. It was the beginning of the episode.

# 101 Q:

Now, from 10:55, when you found the dog, to 11:05, when you got home, did you make any stops along the way?

# 102 A:

Well, as I was walking up Bundy, I saw a police car drive by, so I flagged down the police officer, told him that I had found this stray dog, and I told him the corner where I found the dog. And he told me to go on home, and that he would take care of things. But as I walked, turned on Bundy towards home, the dog continued to follow me, so the police officer followed in his car. But when we got to Montana, he said it was obvious that the dog wanted to stay with me, and would it be okay if I took the dog home, and that he would call animal control and that they would contact me. And I said it was fine, that I would take the dog home at this point.

# 103 Q:

And you did?

# 104 A:

I did. I took the dog back to my apartment building.

# 105 Q:

And did you take the dog inside your house?

# 106 A:

Well, the dog, no. No, I didn't.

# 107 Q:

Tell us what happened.

# 108 A:

The dog followed. I live on the second floor. And the dog followed me up to the landing of my building. And I have a cat, so I didn't want to let the dog inside, so I kept the dog on the landing, and told my wife what had happened, about finding the dog, and showed her the dog. And I got a spare leash from the closet, and then went back down to the front of my building to wait for people from animal control to come by.

# 109 Q:

Did you get a closer look at the dog, to see where the blood was?

# 110 A:

Yes. The courtyard of my building is much better lit. There are lights, and the pool is lit. And there's lights in the stairway. So at this point, I was able to look at the dog more closely. I was afraid that the dog had cut itself, that there was glass in one of the paws, and that's where the blood had come from. I examined the dog more closely and didn't find any glass or any trace of injury on the dog itself.

# 111 Q:

Then what happened?

# 112 A:

Well, I noticed that the dog was dehydrated. First, when the people didn't come from animal control, I thought about walking the dog back towards Dorothy and Bundy, to see if maybe the owners would appear. But when I tried to walk the dog along Montana, it pulled back in the other direction. It wouldn't walk in that direction. So I went back to the courtyard and I noticed that the dog was very dehydrated. At that point, it was panting. So I went upstairs to get some water for the dog. I filled my dog's bowl with water and got it downstairs. As I was walking there, I noticed I had gotten a call, that the light was blinking on my answering machine, so I brought the dog some water and went back upstairs, and discovered that the call was from people at animal control.

# 113 Q:

And then what happened?

# 114 A:

Well, I called back the people at animal control. They said they wouldn't be able to come pick up the dog, that they were closing at midnight; that if they didn't pick up the dog by midnight, that they would be closed up for the night. I said, does that mean that the dog would be alone? And they said yes. And so I told them that I didn't know what I would be doing at that point. I didn't like the idea of driving the dog to animal control and it being locked up in a cage overnight by itself. So I went back downstairs -- my wife was with the dog at this point -- to discuss with my wife what we should do about the dog. We thought about bringing it inside. I didn't want to freak out my cat by bringing this big dog into the house, so I went downstairs to discuss with my wife what we should do with the dog.

# 115 Q:

And what happened next?

# 116 A:

Well, then my neighbor, Sukru, came home and --

# 117 Q:

What is his last name?

# 118 A:

Sukru Boztepe. And he was surprised to see me with this big Akita, and asked me what happened. And I told him what happened and our dilemma with the people from animal control. And we discussed what to do. But then he offered to take the dog for the night, and that I would get it back from him in the morning so I could put up lost dog posters, to see if we could find the owner. And so we agreed to do that. I gave him the dog.

# 119 Q:

Approximately what time did you give Mr. Boztepe the dog?

# 120 A:

Well, I gave him the dog at about 11:50 or so. He had come home about 11:40, and we discussed it for approximately ten minutes or so.

# 121 Q:

So you were out in your courtyard with Mr. Boztepe and your wife, and you were talking to him about ten minutes?

# 122 A:

Yes. His wife, Bettina, had come out of her apartment building -- he lives directly under me -- and so she came out when she heard us talking to Sukru, and we all discussed it for a while. But at 11:50, I handed him the leash, and went upstairs to bed.

# 123 Q:

And what happened in the morning?

# 124 A:

Well, at around 5:00 a.m., there was someone pounding on my door, so I got up out of bed. And it was two -- there was two detectives who said they wanted to talk to me about the dog in connection with a murder.

# 125 Q:

And what did you tell the detectives?

# 126 A:

Well --

# 127 MR. BAKER:

Objection. Hearsay.

# 128 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 129 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Were you awakened from a sound sleep?

# 130 A:

Yes, I was.

# 131 Q:

Did you indicate the time that you found the dog on the corner of Dorothy and Bundy to the detectives?

MR. P. BAKER: Hearsay.

# 132 THE COURT:

You can answer yes or no.

# 133 STEVEN SCHWAB:

Can I hear the question again?

# 134 MR. PETROCELLI:

I'll withdraw the question.

# 135 THE COURT:

All right.

# 136 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) When you handed the dog off at 11:40 to 11:50, that's the last you saw --

# 137 A:

That's the last time I saw the dog, yes.

# 138 Q:

Okay.

MR. P. BAKER: We have no questions. Thank you.

# 139 THE COURT:

Thank you.

# 140 MR. PETROCELLI:

Thank you.

# 141 STEVEN SCHWAB:

Thank you.

Temperature

procedural

Key Quotes (4)

Steven Schwab

I noticed that there was a drip of blood on one of the back legs of the dog, and I bent down further to examine it. I saw that there was blood on the paws of the dog, and that the underside and chest of the dog was very dirty. It was -- there was mud or blood on the chest of the dog.

Direct physical observation establishing the dog had contact with blood, consistent with the dog having walked through the crime scene before Schwab found it.

Steven Schwab

Yes, it appeared moist. It was red and shiny.

The blood appeared fresh and wet, placing the time of the murders before 10:55 p.m. and corroborating the prosecution timeline.

Steven Schwab

The Akita was doing an interesting thing. It was continuing this pattern of barking at the houses. As I walked along the street, as we passed the path to each house, it would look up the path and bark at the house.

Describes the dog's agitated, unusual behavior consistent with a traumatized animal that had just witnessed violence.

Steven Schwab

I examined the dog more closely and didn't find any glass or any trace of injury on the dog itself.

Establishes the blood on the dog was not from the dog's own injury, strongly implying it came from the crime scene.

Evidence (2)

Exhibit 18

Map of the Bundy area used to trace Schwab's dog-walking route

discussed, witness pointed to locations on map

Exhibit 28

Photograph of the Akita dog

identified by witness as the dog he found on the night of June 12, 1994

Notable Exchanges (2)

Daniel Petrocelli•Steven Schwab

Schwab explains his Sunday night routine anchored to Dick Van Dyke Show (10:00–10:30) and Mary Tyler Moore Show (11:00), establishing a precise timeline for when he found the dog.

strategic

Robert Baker•Hiroshi Fujisaki

Baker objected twice on hearsay grounds when Petrocelli tried to elicit what Schwab told detectives at 5 a.m. Both sustained; Petrocelli withdrew the second question.

procedural

Objections

2 objections (2 sustained, 0 overruled)

Proceeding 8028 • 141 utterances • Plaintiff witness

Civil Trial

Department 103