Direct examination of O.J. Simpson (part 1)

📄 Direct examination of O.J. Simpson (part 1) — Monday, November 25, 1996

Address:

C:\DEPT103\CIVIL\1996\NOV\25\DIRECT-EXAMINATION-OF-O-J-SIMP.DOC

TRIAL

▲ Day 22 of 57

◀ Morning session opening Session resumption ▶

Witness: O.J. Simpson
Examiner: Robert Baker
Called by: Defense • Date: Monday, November 25, 1996 • Utterances: 659

Petrocelli methodically dismantles Simpson's account of his activities on the evening of June 12, 1994, using cell phone records, Simpson's own police statement from June 13, and Dr. Lenore Walker's notes to expose a series of contradictions about Paula Barbieri phone calls, the location of his cell phone, and whether he drove his Bronco that night. Simpson offers an elaborate, highly detailed account of chipping golf balls, walking his dog, and making a single call from his driveway — a story absent from his June 13 police statement. The hearing also surfaces that Simpson paid lawyers from San Francisco to conduct practice cross-examination sessions before trial.

# 1 MR. PETROCELLI:

Thank you, Your Honor.

# 2 THE CLERK:

You are still under oath.

Would you please state your name again for the record.

# 3 O.J. SIMPSON:

Orenthal James Simpson.

ORENTHAL JAMES SIMPSON, the witness on the stand at the time of adjournment on Friday, November 22, 1996, having been previously duly sworn, was examined further as follows:

# 4 MR. PETROCELLI:

Morning, ladies and gentlemen.

# 5 JURORS:

Morning.

DIRECT EXAMINATION (continued) BY MR. PETROCELLI:

# 6 Q:

On Friday, we were talking about your activities on June 12, 1994. I'd like to return to that, okay, sir?

Before you went to McDonald's with Mr. Kaelin, you tried calling Paula Barbieri repeatedly from your home telephone, true?

# 7 MR. BAKER:

Asked and answered.

# 8 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 9 A:

I may have. Yes.

# 10 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) And you called not from your cell phone, but from your home phone, inside your house at 753 Rockingham, trying to get in touch with her, correct?

# 11 A:

I may have.

# 12 Q:

You say you may have. What does that mean? Did you or didn't you?

# 13 A:

I don't recall doing it, but I do know that I put some calls in to Paula, yes.

# 14 Q:

And you called her again at 8:58 p.m. correct?

# 15 A:

I may have.

# 16 Q:

And you called her at 8:59 p.m., correct?

# 17 A:

I may have.

# 18 Q:

And you checked your messages a second time from your house, by calling your message manager. True or untrue?

# 19 A:

I never picked up a message from Paula that night, no.

# 20 Q:

You did check your messages at 6:50, and again at 8:55 p.m. to pick up messages from Paula. True or untrue?

# 21 MR. BAKER:

Asked and answered.

# 22 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 23 A:

I don't recall doing that, no.

# 24 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Do you recall?

Are you unsure now, sir, or --

# 25 A:

I know I never picked up any messages from Paula.

# 26 Q:

You told Dr. Lenore Walker you picked up a message from Paula, didn't you?

# 27 A:

No.

# 28 MR. PETROCELLI:

Let me put up the board.

This is?

# 29 MR. FOSTER:

434.

# 30 MR. PETROCELLI:

Exhibit 434, which is a listing of your cell phone calls.

# 31 (The instrument herein referred to as Board entitled Defendant's Cell Phone Calls for the Night of June 12, 1994, was marked for identification as Plaintiffs' Exhibit No. 434.)

# 32 MR. PETROCELLI:

And I'll also put up this other exhibit.

# 33 (Exhibit 2216 displayed, entitled Simpson Telephone Calls - June 12, 1994.)

# 34 MR. PETROCELLI:

This is Exhibit 2216, which would show all the calls you made that are reflected on phone bills for June 12.

# 35 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Now, you have this voice mail system on your cell phone; you call your cell phone, it call-forwards into your voice mail to pick up messages, true?

# 36 A:

I believe so, yes.

# 37 Q:

Okay.

And you see Exhibit 434 shows that you called your message manager at 6:56 for five minutes to pick up a message. Do you see that, sir, on your cell phone record?

# 38 A:

I see -- I don't see where it says pick up message. I do see it's message manager.

# 39 Q:

You do see 6:56 message manager, true?

# 40 A:

Yes.

# 41 Q:

And you also see it again 8:55, message manager, true?

# 42 A:

Yes.

# 43 Q:

And CF stands for call forward, right, on your bill?

# 44 A:

I would assume so, yes.

# 45 Q:

And the reason those entries are on your bill is because you twice picked up messages from your house at Rockingham. True or untrue?

# 46 A:

That's untrue.

# 47 Q:

Okay.

# 48 MR. PETROCELLI:

Put up -- what is that exhibit?

# 49 MR. FOSTER:

2217.

# 50 THE COURT:

2217.

# 51 (Exhibit 2217 displayed on TV screen.)

# 52 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Now, sir, I already showed you the entry for 1856. At 1856, which is 6:56, true?

# 53 A:

Yes.

# 54 Q:

You see the phone record there, 6:56 from your telephone number, 476-4619, Area Code 310, which was your phone number at that time, correct?

# 55 A:

I believe so, yes.

# 56 Q:

Okay. And at 2055 -- that would be 8:55 p.m., right, sir?

# 57 A:

I would assume so.

# 58 Q:

Shows another call from your home phone, and your cell phone indicates 8:55, message manager another minute.

# 59 A:

Yes, I see that.

# 60 Q:

Do you see that?

# 61 A:

Um-hum.

# 62 Q:

And by the way, do you also see that you called at 8:58 and 8:59, the number of Paula Barbieri, a 305 cell phone number. That was her cell phone number, right, from Palm Beach, Florida or wherever she lived, Panama Beach, or wherever it was?

# 63 A:

That's correct.

# 64 Q:

Okay.

So you made all those phone calls at the time shown on these cell phone records, didn't you?

# 65 A:

I would assume so, yes.

# 66 Q:

You'd include picking up messages from Paula, true?

# 67 A:

That's incorrect.

# 68 Q:

And you told that to Dr. Lenore Walker, didn't you?

# 69 MR. BAKER:

Asked and answered.

# 70 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 71 A:

Incorrect.

# 72 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Did you not tell Dr. Lenore Walker, on February 25, 1995, the following: From her notes -- she was taking notes, correct?

# 73 A:

Yes.

# 74 Q:

You saw her taking notes, right?

# 75 A:

Yes.

# 76 Q:

And she was working for you at the time, right?

# 77 A:

I believe the defense, yes.

# 78 Q:

"Called Paula, not home.

"Call forward on car phone message from Paula. Whole long message about golf. Don't see you. He's not sure if in Arizona or Las Vegas, or if angry with him. He listens to message. Kato goes by house."

You told all of that to Dr. Lenore Walker, didn't you, sir?

# 79 A:

That's correct.

# 80 Q:

And you told Dr. Lenore Walker that you got a whole long message about golf from Paula Barbieri, true?

# 81 A:

That's untrue.

# 82 Q:

You also told Dr. Lenore Walker that just about that time, Kato walked by, true?

# 83 A:

I assume so.

# 84 Q:

And Kato walked by your house about 6:56 p.m. after you got back from the recital, true?

# 85 A:

I know after I was back from the recital, Kato came in.

# 86 Q:

In fact, you testified in this courtroom on Friday, that it was exactly at 6:56 that you were in the kitchen with Kato, and you just happened to remember that time exactly, didn't you?

# 87 A:

No, I didn't say exactly. I said about that time. It was about the time I saw Kato.

# 88 Q:

Now, you deny under oath, after looking at these cell phone records and hearing Dr. -- hearing from Dr. Lenore Walker's notes, that you did not pick up the message from Paula, a whole long message from Paula? You deny that?

# 89 A:

That's correct.

# 90 MR. BAKER:

I --

# 91 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) You deny that?

# 92 A:

I deny I didn't pick it up on that cell phone; that's correct.

# 93 Q:

Your story is that you --

# 94 MR. BAKER:

I object to that.

# 95 MR. PETROCELLI:

-- you --

# 96 MR. BAKER:

I object to anything calling "your story."

# 97 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 98 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Your story, sir, is that you -- well, by the way, back up for a second.

You told the police, as we discussed Friday, that you picked up a message -- you picked up your messages, right?

# 99 A:

I believe so.

# 100 Q:

And at the time you told that to the police, hours after -- that was hours after Nicole's death, right?

# 101 A:

I assume so.

# 102 Q:

Before you had met with teams of lawyers and investigators and defense experts, right?

# 103 A:

That's correct.

# 104 Q:

And before you had reviewed cell phone records, right?

# 105 A:

Correct.

# 106 Q:

And you told the police that you picked up -- you said:

"I checked my messages. She had left me a message that she wasn't there, that she had to leave town."

And you were referring to the message that you picked up on your cell phone voice mail at 6:56, true?

# 107 A:

Untrue.

# 108 Q:

Now, your story, sir, told in your deposition earlier this year, is that, well, you did get a message from Paula, but it was when you called her phone machine and there was a message on there for anybody who would call her machine, right?

# 109 A:

Yes.

# 110 Q:

And just like when you call my house and I say we're not home right now, please leave a message, that sort of message, right?

# 111 MR. BAKER:

He wouldn't call your house.

KEY QUOTE

# 112 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) That sort of message?

# 113 A:

That's correct.

# 114 Q:

You want to tell this jury under oath, that when you called Paula's machine, the number anybody could call, there was a whole long message about you and about golf and about her being unhappy and so forth. Is that the story?

# 115 MR. BAKER:

Compound.

# 116 A:

That's -- that's incorrect.

# 117 Q:

There was a whole long message on your (sic) machine directed to you; is that the story?

# 118 A:

I believe it was directed more to me, but it wasn't about golf, no.

# 119 Q:

But anybody could listen to it, right?

# 120 A:

Yes.

# 121 Q:

And it's all about you, right?

# 122 A:

No, it was about her being out of town.

# 123 Q:

So when Lenore Walker wrote in her notes, a whole long message about golf, don't -- you say it's all false, right?

# 124 A:

That's --

# 125 Q:

False?

# 126 A:

Yes, it's false, yes.

# 127 Q:

Is it true that you and Paula had been fighting a bit about golf, sore subject? That's true, right?

# 128 A:

Not then, no. That's incorrect.

# 129 Q:

You fought in Palm Springs about it, didn't you?

Mr. Baker pointed that out in her deposition?

# 130 A:

Previously, Paula would get upset when I went and played a lot of golf, yes.

# 131 Q:

Including the morning of June 12?

# 132 A:

No.

# 133 Q:

You didn't spend the night together and you're going to play golf in the morning; sore subject, true?

# 134 MR. BAKER:

I don't know what question you want him to answer; they're all compound, argumentative. I wish he would ask one question and allow him to answer.

# 135 THE COURT:

Ask one please.

# 136 O.J. SIMPSON:

Can you reask it.

# 137 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) The subject of golf was a sore one at that point in time, the last three weeks of Nicole's life; true or untrue?

# 138 A:

I can't answer that true or untrue. When Paula, often -- me playing golf was a problem, but it was not a conversation either her or I had that weekend.

# 139 Q:

Now, the truth of the matter, sir, is that you were desperate to get in touch with Paula because she had left you, true?

# 140 A:

False.

# 141 Q:

And you were trying all day to get in touch with her, call after call, after call, as these records show, true?

# 142 A:

That's not necessarily true, no.

# 143 Q:

And there are more calls, local calls not reflected on these records, that you made to her, trying to get in touch with her all day, true?

# 144 A:

I wouldn't know. I tried her in my car and I tried her a few times from my house.

# 145 Q:

And the reason you were trying to get in touch with her is because you were feeling alone on that evening, weren't you, sir?

# 146 A:

That's not true.

# 147 Q:

You told that to Tom Lange on the 17th of June, from your (sic) Bronco, that you were feeling so alone, didn't you?

# 148 A:

That's not true.

# 149 Q:

Well, we'll get to that.

And you blamed Nicole for feeling alone, sir, didn't you?

# 150 A:

No.

# 151 Q:

You blamed Nicole because your relationship with Nicole was over, true?

# 152 MR. BAKER:

There's no foundation.

# 153 A:

It had been over for a month.

# 154 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 155 O.J. SIMPSON:

I'm sorry.

# 156 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) And had been over for how long?

# 157 A:

About a month.

# 158 Q:

About three weeks, to be exact, as of the 12th of June, true?

# 159 A:

It officially -- when I looked at a calendar later on, it was Mother's Day.

# 160 Q:

About three weeks to the day, to June 12, not about a month; about three weeks, true?

# 161 A:

I know when we officially split was the 12th -- the 10th or the 12th.

# 162 Q:

You told the police on June 13, that you and Nicole split three weeks before June 13, which is about May 22, true?

# 163 A:

If I said -- I did say that, but I was just approximating.

# 164 Q:

You did say three weeks, right?

# 165 A:

Yes.

# 166 Q:

You said it more than once, didn't you?

# 167 A:

Yes.

# 168 Q:

Okay.

And three weeks from June 13 does -- is not May 10, but May 22, correct?

# 169 A:

I would assume about that, 21 days.

# 170 Q:

And finally, you blamed Nicole because your relationship with Paula was now all messed up, true?

# 171 A:

I can't answer that. You say "now all messed up," which I don't understand.

# 172 Q:

Evening of June 12, 9 o'clock p.m. to be exact, you blamed Paula because -- you blamed Nicole because your relationship with Paula was over?

# 173 A:

No, I didn't believe that.

# 174 Q:

You blame Nicole for your problems with Paula?

# 175 A:

Nicole was a problem with Paula.

# 176 Q:

Now, we've already talked about going to McDonald's, not going to get back into that, except to ask you this:

When you went out to McDonald's, from your house, you went out the front door and you set the alarm, didn't you?

# 177 A:

I thought I did, even though I heard Kato. I thought I did, yes.

# 178 Q:

And you told that to Lenore Walker on February 25, 1995, that you went out the front door of your house and you set the alarm to your house, true?

# 179 A:

I thought I did.

# 180 Q:

Okay.

Now, and by the way, when you went to Kato's room that night to go out and get a burger, your state of mind at that time was, you were going to go out alone, not with him, right?

# 181 A:

Yes.

# 182 Q:

And you made a point of telling him you were going out, right?

# 183 A:

I told him why I needed change, yes.

# 184 Q:

You told him you were going out to get a burger, right?

# 185 A:

Yes.

# 186 Q:

And you never once before this point in time go to Kato Kaelin's room to tell him you were going anywhere, true?

# 187 A:

And I didn't that night. That was not my purpose.

# 188 Q:

But you never went to Kato's room on any other occasion and told him you were going anywhere, true?

# 189 A:

True.

# 190 Q:

This was the very first time in your life you went to Kaelin's room and said I'm going to get a burger?

# 191 A:

True.

# 192 Q:

Now, when you got back from McDonald's, you made a call, another call, your final call to Paula Barbieri at 10:03 p.m., true?

# 193 A:

That's correct.

# 194 Q:

And you're leaving her messages in a number of those calls, aren't you?

# 195 A:

I think I may have left her -- I'm pretty sure I left her one early on and then I believe I might have left her one after. I may have. I know if I did it wouldn't have been more than a couple messages, maybe once for -- once after the recital, and I know I did at 10.

# 196 Q:

Page 8, 9, 12 through 13. I want to talk about this 10:03 time period now.

# 197 A:

Yes.

# 198 Q:

When you spoke to the police detectives on June 13, hours after Nicole's murder, you told the police detectives that you made a phone call to Paula driving over to her house in your Bronco, from your cell phone.

True?

# 199 A:

I don't think that was the 10:03 call. I believe that we were talking about earlier.

# 200 Q:

Excuse me, sir.

Answer this question: When you spoke to the police on June 13, hours after Nicole's death --

# 201 A:

Yes.

# 202 Q:

-- you told the police that you, after the recital --

# 203 A:

Okay.

# 204 Q:

-- made a phone call while driving over to Paula's looking for her, from your Bronco, the car you'd rather drive than any other car, using your cell phone, true?

# 205 A:

I don't think I said from my Bronco, but I did imply that I was driving to Paula's right after the recital and I made a call to Paula.

# 206 Q:

You implied it or you said it?

# 207 A:

I don't recall but I know it was implied.

# 208 Q:

Let me read it to you. Page 8. (Reading.)

"Q. Where did you go from there, the recital?"

# 209 MR. PETROCELLI:

I'm going to skip at the judge's request the "ums" and "greats."

Mr. Baker, I'm at page 8.

# 210 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) (Reading.)

"Where did you go from there, O.J.?

"Home. Home for a while and got in my car for a while, tried to find my girlfriend for a while. Came back to the house."

# 211 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Again, page 9. (Reading.)

"After the recital you're referring to?

"I came home, and then I called Paula as I was going to her house and Paula wasn't home."

# 212 MR. PETROCELLI:

Page 12 and 13.

# 213 MR. BAKER:

Well, that -- read the questions and the answers.

# 214 MR. PETROCELLI:

I was trying to shorten it up. If you want me to read the questions and answers, I'll be happy to, Mr. Baker. I have no problem with that.

Okay. Let's start at page 12.

# 215 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) (Reading.)

"QUESTION" --

# 216 MR. BAKER:

Can you give me a line, please.

# 217 MR. PETROCELLI:

Yeah. We'll start it at line 23, referring to did he take it to the recital, meaning the Bronco.

# 218 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) (Reading.)

"Did you take it to the recital?

"A. No.

"Q. What time was the recital?

"A. Over at about 6:30.

Like I said, I came home, I got in my car, I was going to see my girlfriend, I was calling her and she wasn't around.

"Q. So you drove the --

"A. Bronco.

"Q. You got home in the Rolls, in the Rolls --

"Yeah.

"Q. And then you got in the Bronco?

"A. Bronco, 'cause my phone was in the Bronco.

"Okay.

"A. And cause it's -- the Bronco is -- the Bronco is what I drive.

"Yeah. You know, I drive -- rather drive it than any other car.

And as I was going over there I called her a couple of times, and she wasn't there and that she had left a message. And then I checked my messages, she had left me a message that she wasn't there, that she had to leave town. Then I came back and ended up sitting with Kato."

# 219 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) You told the police you drove to Paula's after the recital, in your Bronco, and made a call to her from your cell phone, true or untrue?

# 220 A:

True.

# 221 Q:

The only time after the recital that you have any cell phone calls to Paula is at what time, looking at your cell phone records?

# 222 A:

10:03.

# 223 Q:

So, sir, you were in your Bronco calling Paula at 10:03, just like you told the police, true?

# 224 A:

That's incorrect.

# 225 Q:

Oh, so you lied to the police?

# 226 A:

No.

# 227 Q:

You have a different story now. It's different now, isn't it?

# 228 A:

I think it's more accurate now.

KEY QUOTE

# 229 Q:

It's different, isn't it?

# 230 A:

Yes.

# 231 Q:

It's -- now you say you didn't get in the Bronco, and drive to Paula's, and call her from the phone, true?

# 232 A:

That's true.

# 233 Q:

That's what you now say, true?

# 234 A:

That's true.

# 235 Q:

Okay. And you now say that of course after meeting with teams of lawyers and investigators and defense experts and seeing that there are cell phone records at 10:03 putting you in the Bronco, true?

# 236 A:

True.

# 237 Q:

And by the way, at the time you gave your statement to the police, you were not familiar with cell phone records, were you?

# 238 A:

I don't understand what you mean.

# 239 Q:

Well, you testified in your deposition, line -- at page 2144, that the cell phone bills go to the office and are paid by someone there, meaning Cathy Randa?

# 240 A:

Yes.

# 241 Q:

Okay.

# 242 A:

But I understand cell phone records.

# 243 Q:

Now you do?

# 244 A:

I always have.

# 245 Q:

You also told the police, sir -- well, withdrawn.

So your story now, then, is that you didn't make this call from the Bronco, right?

# 246 A:

That's correct.

# 247 MR. BAKER:

Objection, argumentative.

# 248 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) And your story --

# 249 MR. BAKER:

I object to the form of the question. It's argumentative.

# 250 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 251 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) And your story now, sir, is that, in fact, your cell phone wasn't even in the Bronco as at 10:03, right?

# 252 A:

That's correct.

# 253 Q:

You're now saying that you took it out of the Bronco hours before?

# 254 A:

That's correct.

# 255 Q:

Let me read what you told to the police about that subject.

One second so I can get the page number for your counsel.

Here it is. Page 15, at line 22. (Reading.)

"Q. "Do you recall bleeding at all in your truck -- in the Bronco?

"A. I recall bleeding at my house and then I went to the Bronco.

The last thing I did before I left, when I was rushing, was went and got my phone out of the Bronco."

Remember saying that to the police?

# 256 A:

I don't think that's complete.

# 257 (Counsel hands document to witness.)

# 258 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Do you remember saying that to the police, yes or no?

# 259 A:

I remember saying that and more to the police.

# 260 Q:

You think this transcript is wrong, is that what you're saying?

# 261 A:

I know it is.

# 262 Q:

Had no problem with it on Friday, did you?

# 263 MR. BAKER:

That's argumentative, Your Honor.

# 264 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 265 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) You told the police that the last thing you did, sir, was you, before leaving for the airport, went out and got your cell phone from the Bronco, because it was in the Bronco, at 11 o'clock, true?

# 266 A:

That's incorrect.

# 267 Q:

Now you're saying the police statement is wrong because you don't want the phone to be in the Bronco at 11 o'clock, true?

# 268 MR. BAKER:

That's argumentative.

# 269 A:

It wasn't in the Bronco.

# 270 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) You don't want it to be there because if it was there at 11, it was there at 10, and if it's there at 10, you're in your Bronco and you're not in your home, and it destroys your alibi?

# 271 MR. BAKER:

All that is alibi. It's great final argument and great sound bites, Your Honor, but it's not a proper question.

# 272 MR. PETROCELLI:

No speaking objections.

# 273 MR. BAKER:

I don't take legal advice from any adversaries.

# 274 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 275 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) What is your story now? By the way, on this, you didn't get the cell phone when you were leaving, you got what?

# 276 MR. BAKER:

Your Honor, this "what your story now" is so argumentative and I object to it.

# 277 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 278 A:

My cell phone comes with attachments, extra batteries, there's a little case that I carry it in when I'm -- with an extra battery, and there's a plug-in you can use in any automobile.

I believe if you got the correct -- if you listen to the tape, and not your -- that's my answer. That's my answer. And I think I implied that when I said that to the police. You just don't have it on your transcript.

# 279 Q:

Sir, I asked you on Friday if what was recorded on the tape was accurate and you said it was?

# 280 A:

No. What was on the tape is accurate, but they don't have the whole thing.

# 281 Q:

Now you're saying you didn't get the cell phone when you were leaving for your one-day trip to Chicago, but you got cell phone accessories, right?

# 282 A:

Yes.

# 283 Q:

That's what you're saying?

# 284 A:

Yes. My cell phone comes in a package and I need the package when I travel.

# 285 Q:

So you specifically remember now, two and a half years later, that it wasn't -- the phone -- the phone wasn't in the Bronco at 10:03, right, you specifically remember that now, right?

# 286 A:

I don't -- I don't get the question. I remember that --

# 287 Q:

You specifically remember your phone was not in the Bronco at 10:03, correct?

# 288 A:

Correct.

# 289 Q:

And you remember -- and you remember that it was accessories, and that's what you meant to tell the police, that you went out to get cell phone accessories for the one-day trip to Chicago, right?

# 290 A:

Yes.

# 291 Q:

Okay.

Let me read what you said at page 16 of your police statement, line 22. I'll start at 16 just for some context. (Reading.)

"Q. So did you do anything -- when did you put the band-aid on it?

"A. Actually, I asked a girl this morning for it and she --

"And she got it?

"Yeah.

"Okay.

"A. 'Cause last night I just put -- I mean when Kato -- When I was leaving he was saying something to me and I was rushing to get my phone and I put a little thing on it and it stopped."

# 292 Q:

Remember telling that to the police?

# 293 A:

I don't remember telling them, but I read the transcripts.

# 294 MR. PETROCELLI:

Put this on the Elmo, Steve.

# 295 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Let me ask you about this.

# 296 MR. PETROCELLI:

Put that on the Elmo.

# 297 (Transcript displayed on Elmo.)

# 298 MR. PETROCELLI:

I want to focus on this. Can you do a little better on that? No, no, no, I want to see the whole thing.

Back, back. Okay. Right there. Move it over.

Okay, can you see that?

# 299 (indicating to TV screen.)

# 300 O.J. SIMPSON:

Yes.

# 301 Q:

First of all, you're clear in your mind, sir, that the time frame you are talking about in giving this answer, about getting your phone, was at the very end of the night when you were leaving and Kato was talking to you, right?

# 302 A:

Correct.

# 303 Q:

And you told the police, I was rushing to get my phone and put a little thing on it, right?

# 304 A:

Correct.

# 305 Q:

And earlier you said the last thing you did when you were talking to the police was you got your phone out of the Bronco, right?

# 306 A:

That's what I said, yes.

# 307 MR. PETROCELLI:

Okay, you can take it off.

# 308 Q:

You were calling Paula, driving in your Bronco to Bundy, calling Paula 'cause you were desperate and you were alone that night, true?

# 309 A:

Untrue.

# 310 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative, Your Honor.

# 311 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 312 A:

Untrue.

# 313 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) You'd have no other reason for calling Paula at 10:03 p.m., you called her all day, true?

# 314 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative.

# 315 Q:

Did you not call Paula all day long starting about 2:12, with your phone records there?

# 316 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative, vague, ambiguous, asked and answered.

# 317 A:

I called --

# 318 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 319 A:

I called Paula a few times that day, yes.

# 320 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) And you knew that she was gone?

# 321 A:

No.

# 322 Q:

Right?

# 323 A:

Not really, no.

# 324 Q:

You told Lenore Walker that's Las Vegas or Arizona. I just read in her notes you told her that February 25, 1995?

# 325 A:

Among other things, yes.

# 326 Q:

So you knew Paula wasn't home?

# 327 A:

No.

# 328 Q:

You were desperately trying to get in touch with her, weren't you?

# 329 A:

I wouldn't have called if I didn't think she might have been around.

# 330 Q:

What your reason, your story, now, sir, is you were looking for a ride to the airport?

# 331 A:

That if she was still in town, that it was still not too late for her to take me to the airport.

# 332 Q:

You knew a limo had been arranged by your secretary, Cathy Randa, to be at your house at 10:45 like clockwork, like always, right?

# 333 A:

Yes.

# 334 Q:

So -- so now you say that you made the phone call standing from where, sir, on the cell phone?

# 335 A:

I was in my front yard near -- if you have a picture of my front yard -- near where my Bentley was parked.

# 336 Q:

Before I show you the front yard, how many phone calls did you make on your cellular phone all day on June 12, outside of your Bronco?

# 337 A:

This would have been the only one.

# 338 Q:

So every other time you used your cell phone that day, 2:12, 2:13, 2:18, 2:22, 2:23, 2:24, you're in the Bronco, right?

# 339 A:

One ride from the golf course in from the Bronco.

# 340 Q:

Where your cell phone was?

# 341 A:

Yes.

# 342 Q:

And it was still in the car in fact when you came home from the golf course?

# 343 A:

That's right.

# 344 Q:

It was still in your car when you were at the recital, weren't you?

# 345 A:

That's correct.

# 346 Q:

Yes. You remember when you say you took it out of the car, the phone out of the Bronco?

# 347 A:

Yes.

# 348 Q:

When do you say, between like 7:30 and 9, thereabouts?

# 349 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative --

# 350 A:

Correct.

# 351 MR. BAKER:

-- when do you say.

# 352 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 353 Q:

The only call you would like this jury to believe that you made from your cell phone not in the Bronco, but in your driveway, is at 10:03, right?

# 354 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative.

# 355 A:

That's correct.

# 356 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 357 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Okay.

So let's go to the story that you told in your deposition in this case.

# 358 (Referring to Exhibit 116)

# 359 Q:

You said you pulled your Bronco in to get some stuff out of it, right?

# 360 A:

Yes.

# 361 Q:

And by the way, the first time you pulled it in, you just took out your golf clubs, right?

# 362 A:

My golf clubs, my cell phone,

# 363 Q:

Cell phone? Sure about that?

# 364 A:

Yes, that was about that time that I took it out.

# 365 Q:

Okay. And you didn't take out the cell phone accessories, did you?

# 366 A:

No, I didn't look for it.

# 367 Q:

Just looked for it -- it was right there in the passenger seat.

# 368 A:

Well, I didn't look for it.

# 369 Q:

What do you mean? It was right there in the passenger seat; how could you have missed it?

# 370 A:

I didn't look for it.

# 371 Q:

Okay.

So you just get the phone out. And by the way, the phone was just by the passenger seat too, it was right there in between the two seats too, right?

# 372 A:

That's correct.

# 373 Q:

You took one, but not the cell phone accessories?

# 374 A:

That's correct.

# 375 Q:

You left the Windbreaker there too, that was over the console, right?

# 376 A:

That's incorrect.

# 377 Q:

Okay. You didn't take the Windbreaker out at this time, did you?

# 378 A:

No.

# 379 Q:

So you just took out the -- the phone and your clubs, right?

# 380 A:

That's correct.

# 381 Q:

And you went inside, did a little stuff, and you parked your car, and you claim you parked it on -- on Rockingham at this time, right?

# 382 MR. BAKER:

Objection. Argumentative, Your Honor.

# 383 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 384 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Prior to around 9 p.m. on Rockingham, right?

# 385 A:

That's correct.

# 386 Q:

You had to make a couple of other trips out to that car that night to get stuff, didn't you?

# 387 A:

I think I looked out there one other time.

# 388 Q:

Well, you looked there for a club, once, right?

# 389 A:

Yes.

# 390 Q:

And then you went out there to get your accessories, right?

# 391 A:

Yes.

# 392 Q:

And you're sore-legged, stiff that night, want to cut down your walking time, right?

# 393 A:

Yes.

# 394 Q:

That's why you took the short distance to the Bentley, because you didn't want to walk the distance to the Bronco, right?

# 395 A:

Not necessarily, no.

# 396 Q:

That's what you said on Friday; you were stiff-legged, that's why you took the Bentley?

# 397 A:

I took the closest car.

# 398 Q:

And you said you were stiff-legged.

Do you want me to read it?

# 399 MR. BAKER:

Yes.

# 400 MR. PETROCELLI:

Can you find it?

# 401 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Said you were sore and stiff, right?

# 402 A:

I was.

# 403 Q:

Okay.

# 404 A:

All day.

# 405 Q:

All day.

And you wanted to take the shortest car, right?

# 406 A:

I just took --

# 407 Q:

Shortest distance?

# 408 A:

I just took the closest car when I came out of my house.

# 409 Q:

But you made a lot of trips to that Bronco that night, didn't you?

# 410 A:

I believe two.

# 411 Q:

And you had to walk out and get it, too, right?

# 412 A:

Yes.

# 413 Q:

Okay.

Now, when you got the phone, you said you put it in your kitchen, right?

# 414 A:

Somewhere in my kitchen.

# 415 Q:

Okay.

Now --

# 416 A:

Where I normally put it.

# 417 Q:

It's around 10 o'clock, it's after McDonald's, and you're getting closer to the 10:03 phone call. Your story is you go in your garage, passing some time, pick up a club or two, open up the garage door, and are going to go out to swing some golf balls, right?

# 418 A:

No, that wasn't my purpose at all.

# 419 Q:

That's what you did, right?

# 420 A:

Among the things I did. I hit four or five balls, yes.

# 421 Q:

Yeah, and as you were going out to the garage to do this and to look for clubs and other things, you realize you left your phone in the kitchen, right?

# 422 A:

I don't think it worked that way. As I said, I wasn't clear if I picked it up before I went out, or either I came back in and picked it up when I came out of the house, I had my cell phone with me.

# 423 Q:

And just so we -- just to satisfy your counsel's request, at page 219, line 14, from Friday's testimony, you decided to take your Bentley to a fast-food store, right?

"A. I decided to drive the car that was closest when I walked out the door. I was a little stiff."

# 424 A:

Yes.

# 425 Q:

"As I'm sure Kato will tell you. And I just took the nearest car when I walked out the front door." Okay.

Let's get back to where we were.

You went and got this phone from the kitchen so that you could go outside and find golf clubs, right?

# 426 A:

Yeah. I -- I --

Yes, I did pick up the phone, either before I went in the garage, or I came out of the garage and grabbed it. I'm not really sure which one, but I did pick up the phone before I came out.

# 427 Q:

You're not sure about which one, but one thing you will swear on your oath, you are sure of, sir, is, you went and you got that phone, didn't you?

# 428 A:

I went outside, yes.

# 429 Q:

Are you absolutely positive that you went in the house at some time -- at 10 o'clock at night and put a phone in your pocket?

# 430 A:

Yes.

# 431 Q:

Okay.

And you remember that, don't you?

# 432 A:

Yes.

# 433 Q:

So then you go outside and you tried to call Paula, right?

# 434 A:

Yes.

# 435 Q:

Well, let me ask you something: How many phones do you have in your house, sir?

# 436 A:

A lot.

# 437 Q:

You have a phone in your kitchen?

# 438 A:

Yes.

# 439 Q:

You have a phone in the kitchen, where the cell phone was?

# 440 A:

Near it, yes.

# 441 Q:

You could have used that phone, couldn't you?

You could have gone into the house, say, you know, what -- instead of getting my cell phone and walking outside and making a call, why don't I just use this phone?

You could have done that, couldn't you?

# 442 A:

I could have.

# 443 Q:

And you didn't, did you?

# 444 A:

I often don't.

# 445 Q:

Who's talking about often? I'm talking about this night.

You didn't do it this night?

# 446 MR. BAKER:

This is argumentative.

# 447 A:

That's correct.

# 448 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 449 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) And you decided to use -- pay more money on your cell phone instead of using a phone to make a local call?

# 450 A:

Do it all the time.

# 451 Q:

Accept you do it all the time.

But you didn't do it all the time that day, did you?

# 452 A:

No.

# 453 Q:

The only time you did it that day, right?

# 454 A:

Yes.

# 455 Q:

Now, when you went outside, you made this -- supposedly made this call from your driveway.

You also say that you -- well, why don't you tell us what you did? Go ahead, tell us -- tell us what you did when you left the garage.

# 456 A:

I grabbed a 3 wood.

# 457 Q:

Give us as much detail as you can.

# 458 A:

As I can. And this is as much detail as I can recall.

I grabbed a 3 wood, and I looked at the face of it and I swung it a bit. And I went to the trunk of my Bentley, where I had another set of clubs 'cause the purpose of going into the garage was to get a sand wedge, which is a special league club, and I was playing with a new set of golf clubs that I had just got from the Calloway people the previous week.

I was on the road and I didn't like the sand wedge that came to it, so I was looking for my old sand wedge that I normally use. And I went into my trunk of my Bentley, where I had a set of clubs.

And I also needed some balls that I play with, a ball called a Maxflite 100HT. Unless you play golf, you don't understand how important that is to a golfer, the type of ball that they play with.

Since I had, I believe, a sleeve of this ball, and I normally play two sleeves a round of golf.

I looked in my trunk, where I had a bunch of balls, and I tried to find nonscuff balls, and I got about four, five nonscuff balls and put them aside.

I got a windbreaker and put it aside, and whatever was in my trunk, and I dropped it on the ground and I took about three or four scuff (sic) balls, dropped them on the grass that was right behind my Bentley, and I took a pitching wedge 'cause I couldn't find any sand wedges at this time. I believe it was right before or directly right after I put a call in to Paula because if she was around, she could have driven me to the airport.

And in any event, I chipped those balls. I sculled one; it hit my playground equipment, and it -- because it was dark there -- it bounced and I was cringing, because I just got all the dents out of my Bentley, and I thought the ball may have hit my Bentley.

Then I hit -- I mean, I hit a ball over into my neighbor's yard, put that club and that pitching wedge back into the trunk of my car, and I walked out of the Rockingham gate and looked into the back of my Bronco to see if there was any clubs in there.

My dog had come out. And in that time, as I said, I put that call in to Paula, my dog went across the street into Mr. Sheinbaum's yard and did her business in the -- in the -- what she normally does in the grass, but not grass -- I can't even think of the name of it now -- then we walked around 'cause the gate had closed and I didn't have any key, and came back in on the other side of Ashford.

I came to -- I -- I can't recall if I went in to the front door then or the garage, but I put the club away, and I either turned off the lights downstairs -- if I had already turned out the lights. I may have turned them off before I went in. But I turned off the lights downstairs, except for my lamps that I normally keep on, and I went upstairs.

# 459 Q:

Now, Mr. Simpson, if I asked you to repeat that, you could do it word for word, couldn't you?

# 460 A:

I -- I may be able to come relatively close to that.

# 461 Q:

You memorized this story, haven't you?

# 462 A:

I recall, to the best of my ability, what I said.

# 463 Q:

You memorized it, have you not? You've sat --

# 464 MR. BAKER:

Objection.

# 465 Q:

You've sat down, rehearsed it and memorized it?

# 466 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative, Your Honor.

# 467 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 468 A:

I don't think I've ever rehearsed it. I told the story before --

# 469 Q:

And you've had lawyers come down from San Francisco and cross-examine you in practice sessions, haven't you, to get it straight?

# 470 A:

I don't -- I had some lawyers come from San Francisco. What we did, I think, is privileged.

# 471 Q:

That's for the Judge to decide, not you, Mr. Simpson.

You had lawyers subject you to practice rounds to get it right --

# 472 MR. BAKER:

I object Your Honor.

# 473 Q:

-- didn't you?

# 474 MR. BAKER:

I object. That's immaterial and it's also privileged if it ever happened.

# 475 Q:

These are not --

# 476 THE COURT:

Practice rounds are not privileged.

# 477 MR. BAKER:

I'm sorry?

# 478 THE COURT:

Practice rounds are not privileged.

# 479 MR. BAKER:

Practice rounds?

May we have a hearing on this, Your Honor?

# 480 THE COURT:

No.

# 481 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Answer the question, sir.

# 482 A:

I had lawyers come down. I don't know I wouldn't characterize practice rounds and -- as practice rounds, when lawyers came down and we went through what took place.

# 483 Q:

You don't mean went through with -- these weren't your lawyers.

# 484 THE COURT:

We're not going into the subject.

# 485 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) No. But these were not lawyers representing you at any time?

# 486 MR. BAKER:

I object to this.

# 487 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 488 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) These were people you never met before that came out and examined you cold, right?

# 489 MR. BAKER:

I object to this, Your Honor.

# 490 MR. PETROCELLI:

They're not his attorneys, Your Honor.

# 491 MR. BAKER:

That's an assertion that is made by Mr. Petrocelli, without any foundation whatsoever.

# 492 Q:

Answer the last question.

# 493 MR. BAKER:

Object to him answering any questions about this.

# 494 THE COURT:

Last question overruled.

# 495 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Go ahead.

# 496 MR. BAKER:

Doesn't the privilege apply in this courtroom to my client?

# 497 THE COURT:

That portion is not privileged.

# 498 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Please answer the question after the reporter reads it back you, sir.

# 499 MR. BAKER:

I wish the Evidence Code applied in here.

# 500 MR. PETROCELLI:

I would object to these kinds of comments in front of the jury. They're inappropriate.

# 501 THE COURT:

Read the question back.

THE COURT REPORTER: (READING)

"Q. And you've had lawyers come down from San Francisco and cross-examine you in practice sessions, haven't you, to get it straight?"

# 502 THE COURT:

That isn't the question.

# 503 MR. PETROCELLI:

I'll ask it again.

You had lawyers come down from San Francisco who you never met before, to cross-examine you?

# 504 MR. BAKER:

I object. There's no time frame. There's nothing in this -- if it occurred, it's privileged communication.

# 505 THE COURT:

That is overruled.

# 506 MR. PETROCELLI:

Answer the question.

# 507 A:

I had lawyers come down whom I paid, so they were my lawyers when they got there. And we talked about a lot of things, and they did question me on some things, yes.

KEY QUOTE

# 508 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Did they cross-examine you about this story here?

# 509 THE COURT:

Sustain the objection to that.

# 510 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Okay. Let's move on.

Now, by the way, this whole story that you just told was in rather exteraordinary detail.

# 511 MR. BAKER:

Your Honor, I object. I object to this nonsense, Mr. Petrocelli putting his spin on what my client says.

# 512 MR. PETROCELLI:

You would agree --

# 513 MR. BAKER:

I want --

# 514 THE COURT:

Excuse me.

# 515 MR. BAKER:

-- want a ruling on that.

# 516 THE COURT:

I'll sustain the objection.

# 517 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) You would agree that you have quite an extraordinary recall of the events that you just related to the jury, correct?

# 518 A:

I wouldn't characterize it as extraordinary, no.

# 519 Q:

Pretty detailed, right?

# 520 A:

That as best as I can recall, I told the jury.

# 521 Q:

And you didn't tell the police any of those details, did you, sir?

# 522 A:

I told the police -- I answered every question the police asked me.

# 523 Q:

Did you tell the police about chipping golf balls?

# 524 MR. BAKER:

I object, Your Honor. That assumes that the police asked him about that.

# 525 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 526 A:

I don't believe the police asked me --

# 527 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) I didn't ask you if they --

# 528 A:

-- about what happened after I came back from --

# 529 Q:

Excuse me, Mr. Simpson. I only asked you if you ever told the police, for any reason, whether you chipped golf balls that night. Yes or no?

# 530 MR. BAKER:

That assumes that there is a question asking that. And to assert that that occurred is a negative poignant, Your Honor, and I object to it.

# 531 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 532 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Please --

# 533 THE COURT:

Answer the question.

# 534 A:

No.

# 535 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) I want the question back. I'm going to ask it again, so we don't have an objection.

Did you, on June 13, hours after Nicole's death, tell the police that you had chipped golf balls? Yes or no?

# 536 MR. BAKER:

I object to it again.

# 537 THE COURT:

Overruled. Answer it.

# 538 A:

No.

# 539 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Did you tell the police, hours after Nicole's death, that you took a walk and that your dog went into the Sheinbaum lawn and did her business? Say anything -- any of that?

# 540 A:

No.

# 541 Q:

Did you tell the police that you made a phone call to Paula at 10:03 from your driveway?

# 542 A:

No.

# 543 Q:

Did you tell the police anything about 3 woods and 4 woods and any of that stuff?

# 544 A:

No.

# 545 Q:

Did you tell the police anything about what light you turned on and off as you went from one part of your movements to the next?

# 546 A:

No.

# 547 Q:

And you told that story in your deposition, after you heard all the witnesses testify and all the evidence, correct?

# 548 A:

I think my deposition was after all of that.

# 549 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative, compound.

# 550 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 551 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) You knew exactly what you had to say to meet and defeat all the witnesses and evidence that was against you, true?

KEY QUOTE

# 552 MR. BAKER:

Great sound bite. Horribly argumentative.

# 553 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) If he has a legal objection, make it. But this stuff about sound bites is showboating.

# 554 THE COURT:

Excuse me?

# 555 MR. BAKER:

This is showboating. Right there is showboating.

# 556 THE COURT:

Excuse me. That answer is overruled.

# 557 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Please repeat the question.

# 558 THE COURT:

I'm sorry. I'll sustain that objection.

Ask a question without arguing it, please.

# 559 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Okay.

Now -- now, you -- what time did you take this walk, by the way, when you went outside your property?

# 560 A:

The only -- well, obviously if 10:03 was a phone call, it was approximately sometime around that time.

# 561 Q:

Well, tell me exactly when it was, as best as you can recall.

You were outside the property on June 12, 1994?

# 562 A:

I couldn't tell you exactly. I would say sometime between 10:00. And if the call is 10:03, would be probably sometime five to 10:00 or 10:00 and 10:15 or so, whichever time it took me to do what I just described to you.

# 563 Q:

Well, let's get this clear.

First of all, when you went outside the property to take the dog for a walk or whatever it is that you did --

# 564 A:

That's not why I went outside the property.

# 565 Q:

You went out to look in the car?

# 566 A:

Yeah. I looked in the back to see if there were any clubs. I didn't see any clubs.

# 567 Q:

You didn't open the car, did you?

# 568 A:

No, I don't believe so.

# 569 Q:

When you walked out to Rockingham and looked inside the Bronco, had you already made your phone call to Paula at 10:03? Yes or no?

# 570 A:

To the best of my memory, I did.

# 571 Q:

When you went out on Rockingham, looked in the car, then you were -- then, sort of walking along the property on the outside, swinging your 3 wood, is it?

# 572 A:

As you asked the question, I may have made the call outside there, but my memory is, it was in the driveway. It could have been right when I went outside the gate. I'm not sure exactly.

# 573 Q:

Now, you're not sure whether it was the driveway or the street?

# 574 A:

Well, I --

# 575 Q:

Yes or no?

# 576 A:

All along the same time. I was walking, so it could have been while I was walking.

# 577 Q:

Excuse me. Where did you make the call from, the driveway or the street?

# 578 A:

I'm pretty sure it was the driveway, but it could have been as I went out the gate, also.

I mean, with all -- it was all a matter of minutes, seconds.

# 579 Q:

Let's talk about the time you were outside here.

You went along Rockingham north, and then you turned what, right on Ashford?

# 580 A:

Yes.

# 581 Q:

Then you came in the Ashford gate, right?

# 582 A:

Yes.

# 583 Q:

Okay.

You go anywhere else?

# 584 A:

No.

# 585 Q:

Now, tell me the time that you were on Rockingham and Ashford, outside your property. Tell me the time, the whole time.

# 586 A:

What do you mean, "the time?"

# 587 Q:

The interval of time, was it 10:00 to 10:15?

Was it 10:00 to 10:30?

Was it 10:45?

Was it 9:30?

When was it, sir?

# 588 A:

All of this took place sometime, evidently, right before 10:00.

I remember my thought process was, there was still time. If Paula was there, that she could get there to take me to the airport. So it was from five to 10:00, 10:00 to roughly -- I would say the whole thing took place 10 or 15 minutes from going outside, doing this, and walking back in. So not much more than that.

# 589 Q:

So what time did you roll into the Ashford Street gate, there?

# 590 A:

If I -- I mean, I'm guessing now.

# 591 Q:

Don't guess.

# 592 A:

You want me to guess?

# 593 Q:

No, I want you to give us your best recollection sir.

# 594 A:

I would be guessing.

# 595 Q:

You don't know?

# 596 A:

You don't want me to guess.

I guess -- I would say 10:15, maybe.

# 597 Q:

That's a guess?

# 598 A:

That's a guess.

# 599 Q:

It could have been 10:30?

# 600 A:

No.

# 601 Q:

How do you know it couldn't have been? You just said you were guessing.

# 602 A:

I went upstairs. I recall having a little time before the limo driver would call me.

My limo drivers always call me 15 minutes before the call time, and that historically is when I go into gear, doing my final preparations to leave, and I knew I had time to sit on my bed, which I did when I went back in the house.

# 603 Q:

It could have been 10:25 that you entered that Ashford Street gate; true or untrue?

# 604 A:

No, it was no later than 10:15. At the worse, it would have been 10:15 to maybe 10:20, but it wasn't anytime later than that, because I knew I had a little time when I went upstairs to sit on my bed and --

# 605 Q:

But you were just -- you're just guessing at these times?

# 606 A:

I'm not saying exactly what time I got in or the time when I came out of the garage. And I knew it was roughly -- I knew the whole process took roughly 10, at the most, 15 minutes.

And I can -- I can recall thinking that Paula had time to come, and I can recall, seeing the phone records, that it had to be around that period of time, and I knew I was back in the house from the time I finished that process, certainly no more than five to eight minutes.

# 607 Q:

So, sir, it's absolutely crystal clear in your mind, as you sit here and testify before this jury, that you could not have walked past Ashford Street and entered into this gate at 10:25.

Is that absolutely crystal clear in your mind? Yes or no?

# 608 A:

Yes.

# 609 Q:

And the reason it is, is because you know that Allan Park is sitting out there at 10:23, smoking a cigarette, and he would have seen you, true?

# 610 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative, Your Honor.

# 611 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 612 A:

If I would have been there at that time --

# 613 MR. BAKER:

It was sustained, Mr. Simpson. O.J., it's sustained.

# 614 A:

I'm sorry.

# 615 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) When you first put yourself out there in that street prior to 10:25, you had heard the testimony of Allan Park that he was out there at 10:23, right?

# 616 MR. BAKER:

Argumentative.

# 617 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 618 A:

I'm sorry?

# 619 Q:

When you first testified?

# 620 A:

Testified?

# 621 Q:

Testified.

# 622 A:

Okay.

# 623 Q:

You had already heard the testimony of Allan Park that he was out there at 10:23, right?

# 624 A:

Correct.

# 625 Q:

Also, sir, you also heard the testimony of a man named Charles Cale, that he walked his dog down near this corner of Rockingham and Ashford?

# 626 A:

Yes.

# 627 MR. BAKER:

I'm going to object.

# 628 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) You heard the testimony he was there between 9:30 and 9:45, correct?

# 629 MR. BAKER:

I object. This all calls for hearsay. This is not proper cross-examination.

# 630 THE COURT:

Overruled.

# 631 A:

Yes.

# 632 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) Now, are you sure, sir, that you weren't out in this area here, on Rockingham, between 9:30 and 9:45?

# 633 A:

Yes.

# 634 Q:

You're sure, right?

# 635 A:

Yes.

I'm sorry, when -- you said 9:30?

# 636 Q:

To 9:45.

# 637 A:

9:30?

# 638 Q:

Yeah, 9:30 p.m. to 9:45, aren't you sure you weren't doing your little walking during that time?

# 639 A:

I think 9:30 I may have been driving back from McDonald's.

# 640 Q:

Okay.

So you're back by 9:35, right?

# 641 A:

Yeah.

# 642 Q:

Okay.

So between 9:35 and 9:45, you sure you're not out there on the street?

# 643 A:

Yes.

# 644 Q:

So you can definitively tell this jury that when you were outside that property, it was absolutely after 9:45 p.m., true?

# 645 A:

Yes.

# 646 Q:

And you can definitively tell this jury that you went inside the property before 10:23 p.m., right?

# 647 A:

Yes.

# 648 Q:

And that has nothing to do with the fact that those witnesses testified, in your presence, about times, right?

# 649 MR. BAKER:

I object. This is argumentative.

# 650 THE COURT:

Sustained.

# 651 Q:

(BY MR. PETROCELLI) By the way, you testified at your deposition that the only time you looked at a clock that night prior to 11 o'clock was when you were sitting in your bed and you saw that it was about 10:35, 10:40.

Remember that testimony?

# 652 A:

No, I don't remember if that's the only time I looked at a clock, but I do know that that's when I looked at a clock.

# 653 Q:

Well, you --

# 654 A:

Yeah, for sure, that I looked at a clock.

# 655 Q:

Well, you don't recall looking at clocks while you were going outside your walk, do you?

# 656 A:

No.

# 657 Q:

Okay.

# 658 MR. PETROCELLI:

Okay. Now, I'm going to start --

# 659 THE COURT:

All right.

10-minute recess.

Ladies and gentlemen, don't talk about the case, don't form or express any opinions.

Temperature

heated

Key Quotes (5)

O.J. Simpson

I think it's more accurate now.

Simpson's admission that his current story differs from what he told police on June 13, 1994 — he now denies driving the Bronco to Paula's after the recital, which he had clearly implied to detectives.

O.J. Simpson

I had lawyers come down whom I paid, so they were my lawyers when they got there. And we talked about a lot of things, and they did question me on some things, yes.

Simpson confirms he hired outside lawyers to conduct practice cross-examination sessions — Petrocelli's point being that Simpson's detailed alibi story was rehearsed and constructed to defeat known evidence.

Daniel Petrocelli

You knew exactly what you had to say to meet and defeat all the witnesses and evidence that was against you, true?

The theory of the prosecution in a single sentence: that Simpson's elaborate alibi was reverse-engineered from known evidence after years of preparation.

O.J. Simpson

The last thing I did before I left, when I was rushing, was went and got my phone out of the Bronco.

Simpson's own words from the June 13 police statement, which he now disavows — placing the phone (and by implication, Simpson himself) in the Bronco at or near 11 p.m.

Robert Baker

He wouldn't call your house.

A rare comedic interjection from Baker when Petrocelli used himself as an analogy for voicemail outgoing messages — lightening a tense moment.

Evidence (6)

Plaintiffs' Exhibit 434

Board showing Defendant's cell phone calls for the night of June 12, 1994

displayed to witness and jury, used to establish message manager calls at 6:56 and 8:55 p.m.

Exhibit 2216

Comprehensive chart of all Simpson telephone calls on June 12, 1994 from phone bills

displayed alongside Exhibit 434 to corroborate call times and recipients

Exhibit 2217

Phone records displayed on TV screen showing 6:56 and 8:55 message manager calls and 8:58/8:59 calls to Paula Barbieri's 305 cell number

displayed on Elmo/TV screen, used to press Simpson on whether he retrieved Paula's voicemail

Exhibit 116

Simpson's civil deposition testimony

referenced to establish Simpson's prior account of Bronco use and cell phone retrieval

Informal

Dr. Lenore Walker's handwritten notes from February 25, 1995 session with Simpson

read aloud to impeach Simpson — notes record him saying he received 'a whole long message about golf' from Paula via call-forward voicemail

Informal

Transcript of Simpson's June 13, 1994 police statement (pages 8, 9, 12-13, 15-16 referenced)

read into record to show Simpson told police he drove Bronco to Paula's after recital and that the last thing he did before leaving was retrieve his phone from the Bronco

Notable Exchanges (4)

Daniel Petrocelli•O.J. Simpson

Petrocelli walks Simpson through the logical trap: every other cell phone call that day was made from the Bronco where the phone lived; the 10:03 call is the sole exception Simpson now claims — made standing in his driveway after he allegedly moved the phone inside hours earlier.

strategic

Daniel Petrocelli•O.J. Simpson•Robert Baker•Hiroshi Fujisaki

Petrocelli reveals that Simpson paid outside lawyers from San Francisco to conduct practice cross-examination sessions. Baker objects on privilege grounds; Fujisaki rules that 'practice rounds are not privileged.' Baker asks for a hearing; Fujisaki replies with a single word: 'No.'

revealing

O.J. Simpson•Daniel Petrocelli

Simpson delivers an extensive, highly choreographed account of his activities between roughly 10:00 and 10:15 p.m. — chipping golf balls, sculling one into playground equipment, worrying about his Bentley's paint, walking the dog across to the Sheinbaum lawn, swinging a 3-wood. Petrocelli immediately notes that none of these details appeared in his police statement 24 hours after the murders.

strategic

Daniel Petrocelli•O.J. Simpson

Petrocelli presses Simpson on whether he could have been outside his property at 10:23 — the time Allan Park testified he was watching the front of the estate — and Simpson insists he was back inside by 10:15 at the latest. Petrocelli then establishes Simpson already knew Park's testimony when he first gave this version.

devastating

Light Moments (3)

Robert Baker

When Petrocelli used 'just like when you call my house' as an analogy for outgoing voicemail messages, Baker shot back: 'He wouldn't call your house.'

Robert Baker / Daniel Petrocelli

Baker objecting to Petrocelli's questions as 'great sound bites' prompts Petrocelli to snap back: 'If he has a legal objection, make it. But this stuff about sound bites is showboating.' Baker retorts: 'This is showboating. Right there is showboating.' Fujisaki is visibly exasperated.

O.J. Simpson

Simpson, defending the importance of his specific Maxfli 100HT golf ball: 'Unless you play golf, you don't understand how important that is to a golfer, the type of ball that they play with.'

Credibility Attacks (4)

⚔ O.J. Simpson

prior inconsistent statement (police statement vs. trial testimony)

Simpson told police on June 13 that he drove his Bronco to Paula's after the recital and called her from the car phone. He now claims he never drove the Bronco that night and made the 10:03 call standing in his driveway.

⚔ O.J. Simpson

prior inconsistent statement (police statement vs. trial testimony)

Simpson told police 'the last thing I did before I left was went and got my phone out of the Bronco' — placing his phone, and thus himself, at the Bronco near 11 p.m. He now says the phone had been inside since early evening and he retrieved only accessories.

⚔ O.J. Simpson

prior inconsistent statement (Dr. Lenore Walker notes vs. trial testimony)

Walker's February 1995 notes, taken while she was working for the defense, record Simpson saying he received 'a whole long message about golf' from Paula via call-forward voicemail. Simpson now denies the message was about golf and denies it was a personal voicemail.

⚔ O.J. Simpson

fabrication / story evolution

Simpson's elaborate 10 p.m. alibi — chipping golf balls, walking the dog across to the Sheinbaum lawn, swinging a 3-wood — was entirely absent from his June 13 police statement and appeared only after he reviewed all witness testimony and physical evidence, and after paid lawyers conducted practice cross-examination sessions.

Witness Demeanor

Simpson repeatedly uses 'I may have,' 'I would assume,' and 'I believe' when confronted with phone records, then becomes more precise and emphatic when asserting his alibi narrative.

When asked if he memorized his elaborate alibi story, Simpson does not flatly deny it — 'I recall, to the best of my ability, what I said.'

Simpson corrects Petrocelli mid-answer on multiple occasions, insisting on the distinction between 'implied' and 'said,' and between 'phone' and 'cell phone accessories.'

Simpson at one point answers a question after Fujisaki sustained the objection; Baker has to physically interrupt him: 'It was sustained, Mr. Simpson. O.J., it's sustained.'

Objections

32 objections (7 sustained, 22 overruled)

Proceeding 8393 • 659 utterances • Defense witness

Civil Trial

Department 103